Massive's 'new sound' and default preset act differently?

[Brandice]

Ok so I've always had some problems with massive when making pad sounds and such. This time I wanted to take a deeper look into it and I discovered something weird;

When you make a synth out of default preset of massive (the one that opens up when you start massive), there's a huge difference between the sound compared to a synth made out of "new sound"-preset.

Has anyone else ran across this problem before?

I rendered a short clip demonstrating the difference. The two synths play a reversed A# minor chord on loop. Both look exactly the same in massive. I have massive version of 1.1.5.
https://www.box.com/s/c5b48a20057dcea275f4

The first one is made out of default preset and the second one's made out of new sound-preset.

Here are pictures of what each of these synths look in massive:

Default:
https://www.box.com/s/aa200babf05fcb965b08
New Sound:
https://www.box.com/s/d4b689968b061096e6b9

[OllieScott]

not that i use massive but the "new sound" picture has macros assigned where as the default one doesnt. Also the intensity on the 3rd osc is slightly different and the 4 env is assigned to ad vibrato on the new sound picture. Dont know if that affects it though

[Brandice]

Looks like it was the voicing tab's pitch cutoff that I had missed. Stupid me...

Switched off it sounds like this:

https://www.box.com/s/a2b7c3468b703f2cdf6d

Sounds like each time the sound loops it sounds different; like the frequency was higher/lower every time. Anyone know why? Can it be disabled so that each playtime sounds the same?

[Maxxan]

Yeah, the settings that makes each trigger note sound the same is Restart Via Gate in the Osc tab. It makes all the oscillators start at 'zero' phase instead of wherever it was before, don't know the actual terminology but that's what it does. Note that using this is combination with pitch cutoff yields some seriously fucked up sounds so a better option would be to detune the oscillators instead. Sometimes this settings alters sounds a lot so make sure to always experiment with turning it on and off when you're playing around. Really cool.

Another thing that differs is Env 4, the master amp envelope which has some decay etc in the default patch.

[Brian Oblivion]

when you use restart via gate, which you have to if you want a consistent sound every time you press a key, you can manually alter the start position for each of the oscillators in the box below it, so you can tweak them to sound like any of the variations you get when theyre left to random, it doesnt have to ruin the sound if you dont leave them all starting at 0.

[Brandice]

when you use restart via gate, which you have to if you want a consistent sound every time you press a key, you can manually alter the start position for each of the oscillators in the box below it, so you can tweak them to sound like any of the variations you get when theyre left to random, it doesnt have to ruin the sound if you dont leave them all starting at 0.

Which box are we talking about here? The envelope box or the oscillator boxes (with pitch, wt position, intensity and amp knobs)? Learning how to make that consistent sound would definitely make my day.

[NinjaEdit]

Is massive really that great for pads?

[sunny_b_uk]

when you use restart via gate, which you have to if you want a consistent sound every time you press a key, you can manually alter the start position for each of the oscillators in the box below it, so you can tweak them to sound like any of the variations you get when theyre left to random, it doesnt have to ruin the sound if you dont leave them all starting at 0.

Which box are we talking about here? The envelope box or the oscillator boxes (with pitch, wt position, intensity and amp knobs)? Learning how to make that consistent sound would definitely make my day.

just look for "restart via gate" like he said

[Perej]

Is massive really that great for pads?

no

[Brian Oblivion]

when you use restart via gate, which you have to if you want a consistent sound every time you press a key, you can manually alter the start position for each of the oscillators in the box below it, so you can tweak them to sound like any of the variations you get when theyre left to random, it doesnt have to ruin the sound if you dont leave them all starting at 0.

Which box are we talking about here? The envelope box or the oscillator boxes (with pitch, wt position, intensity and amp knobs)? Learning how to make that consistent sound would definitely make my day.

here, in the 'OSC' tab in the middle. The 'Oscillator Phases' box is what we are dealing with. I may be wrong here as most of what I know of this synth has been experimentation, but its my current understanding that the 'Restart via Gate' button locks the phase of the oscillators to each key press, that means that when you check it, each of the oscillators will start their wave shapes from the beginning '0' point on every note. What that will do in sonic terms is remove a lot of the twisting, phasing textures you get when they are out of phase by random amounts every time you play a note, but it becomes consistent.

Then the 'Osc 1', 'Osc2' etc sliders below allow you to pull the phase of the oscillators out of alignment again so that they consistently start out of phase on each note by the same amount. As you move those sliders around you will notice different frequencies in the sound being amplified or muted by being in or out of phase, resulting in different tones and textures, sometimes its better than an eq for balancing the frequencies in the bass in an appealing way, or just forcing a deeper/more fluctuating growl out of angry patches.

[Brandice]

when you use restart via gate, which you have to if you want a consistent sound every time you press a key, you can manually alter the start position for each of the oscillators in the box below it, so you can tweak them to sound like any of the variations you get when theyre left to random, it doesnt have to ruin the sound if you dont leave them all starting at 0.

Which box are we talking about here? The envelope box or the oscillator boxes (with pitch, wt position, intensity and amp knobs)? Learning how to make that consistent sound would definitely make my day.

here, in the 'OSC' tab in the middle. The 'Oscillator Phases' box is what we are dealing with. I may be wrong here as most of what I know of this synth has been experimentation, but its my current understanding that the 'Restart via Gate' button locks the phase of the oscillators to each key press, that means that when you check it, each of the oscillators will start their wave shapes from the beginning '0' point on every note. What that will do in sonic terms is remove a lot of the twisting, phasing textures you get when they are out of phase by random amounts every time you play a note, but it becomes consistent.

Then the 'Osc 1', 'Osc2' etc sliders below allow you to pull the phase of the oscillators out of alignment again so that they consistently start out of phase on each note by the same amount. As you move those sliders around you will notice different frequencies in the sound being amplified or muted by being in or out of phase, resulting in different tones and textures, sometimes its better than an eq for balancing the frequencies in the bass in an appealing way, or just forcing a deeper/more fluctuating growl out of angry patches.

Thank you so much! You have made my day