Louder tracks?

[macc]

the ridiculously-silly-bastard-compressor-as-mix-magnifying-glass thing a lot

Qu'est-ce que c'est?

As in, wtf is that?

cheers

I thought you might know this one man - written about it enough over the years on SC, still kills me (not that I ever get the chance to use it any more!).

Actually, I wrote an email about it to someone recently...
found it.

It's pretty simple. Get pretty much any compressor and put it in your output. Set the ratio to maximum, threshold very deep (like -30 or 40dB), attack and release to minimum. Now set the make up gain up so you can hear it again. It will be distorted to f#ck

Now, slowly increase the release and suddenly you'll find at a certain point that the distrotion stops. Keep it going a little more, you'll probably end up with a setting of 200-300ms (it doesn't matter too much, so long as it is fairly long). Then bypass on and off, and VERY CAREFULLY set the make up gain so that when it is all banging in your song, the perceived volume with the compressor in and out are as close as possible.

Now save that as a preset and save it in your output channel in your default template (if you have one).

Now when you turn it on, the compressor will cloooobber your tune hard. Anything that is too loud will push the rest down dramatically and stick out like a sore thumb.

In short, when your mix is bang on, your tune should sound pretty much identical with the compressor in or out. The only thing that really makes it a bit tough is rhtyhmic sub bass (think occasional big bass notes), as this will really cause stuff to pump in and out. With practice you listen around this somewhat, but with a continuous bass line it isn't a problem.

You may also find (depending how good the compressor is) that it will draw your attention to spectral imbalances in your mix too - any big prominent areas that perhaps should not be will come to the fore. A little eq/general mixing with the compressor switched in before switching it out and you will probably find that it sounds a lot better.

Oh - and when your mixes get really good and it starts sounding very similar with or without - don't forget to turn it off. Yes, I have mixed down entire tunes with it still turned on - LOL

Not a cure for everything, but a handy tool in the box

The good news for you Mr PDX, is that I have uploaded the LA2A preset I favour for this job these days, and you can find it here;

http://www.sendspace.com/file/rp905z

[paradigm_x]

oh that thing. you did that MDA Limiter & FXP package years ago. Well handy hint that.

i nearly wrote 'tell em the mda trick' in the DOA Q&A but it went off on a mad one about phase shift


Didnt quite get the terminololoroflology

The good news for you Mr PDX, is that I have uploaded the LA2A preset I favour for this job these days, and you can find it here;

http://www.sendspace.com/file/rp905z

thank you very much mr macchiochi

[macc]

oh that thing. you did that MDA Limiter & FXP package years ago. Well handy hint that.

Aye - that one

I like LA2A even better though as it really helps you control your lower mids, naturally bringing them out as it does.

thank you very much mr macchiochi

Close enough :teef:

[osdenyer]

Surely pushing the red zone would only really get a nice result with analogue. Digital clipping sounds good on some things, but surely it's still taking up a lot of room if you do it to individual tracks?

true true true!

I agree, with digital mastering, you really do have a ceiling to work under, and on very special occasions, clipping may sound good. I recon leaving mixes cleaner without clipping is the safest option, and try focusing on "keeping your head beneath the celing" as much as possible, especially towards the lower end, and then gaining up the master out bus

...peace

[macc]

A lot of analogue sounds shit in the red too. Pushing cheap transistors in cheap desks for example sounds like shit IMO, though some people swear by it, same as anything else.

Pushing high end transformers though = sex.

[rob sparx]

Maybe he meant on an individiual track level? I can see more sense in that. That would give a reasonable result at the output...

The main reason for me working my way tho is for DJing my 'just playable' tunes - by writing them under pressure their volume easily matches mastered tunes which doesn't always happen when u whack a quiet premaster through a limiter. As im often writing my tunes with a limiter on the master volume from near the start of the tune (it does get taken off for the final mixdown) I tailor the mix to suit the character of the limiter which I find can work better then just whacking a premaster though a limiter after its been finished (sounds a bit squashed sometimes).

Why is this though? In the past, I wrote and mixed like this, but I've been switching over to this -3db thing and am loving it. Mixing like this is SO much easier. But I haven't taken anything to my 'home computer' mastering (IL's maximus). Are you telling me I'm likely to get a squashed master, that I wouldn't get if I had written and mixed with a limiter on the master out?

Depends on how good the mix is in the tune - I just like to know how loud my track will sound when it gets mastered so I always get a mix sounding the way I want and at the same volume as tunes I'm gonna be mixing it with. If you want to play a tune out before its been mastered then your gonna have to boost it anyway unless you think club limiters sound good!

Working at higher levels is good for soloing a few channels together as if theres any frequency clashes u can hear distortion that you wouldn't hear at lower volumes - then you can EQ/process the sound until theres no audiable distortion. Can you see where im coming from? If u did a quieter mixdown and at no point in doing your mixdown drove the tune a bit louder to see how it sounds u might miss some of these frequency clashes and the result is that you can't boost the volume as much before the sound starts cooking at the mastering stage as those frequencies are still there. The mastering engineer can change the EQ but they can't work miracles and you might end up having to change the way your tune sounds from how you intended it to if you want to get the extra volume.

Its the harder music that this is gonna help with more I don't push the volume as much for the more musical tunes and I'm gonna mix down and moniter more quietly in these tunes as well from now on so theres less clipping, see whether it can make my sound a bit smoother?

[nova.k]

i know this is OT, but Rob i just head Sludge.. man that is some heavy shit

[rob sparx]

i know this is OT, but Rob i just head Sludge.. man that is some heavy shit

Thanx man - thats the sort of tune that my technique works well on!

[gkmusic]

cheers for the advice, especially macc's got alot out of that

[jtransition]

I hate to rattle on about this but please remember that heavy compression or limiting or over driving plug ins or normalising all create digital artifactcs that will not tranlate to vinyl also if you intend to ever ask anyone to master your tunes it would be advisable to make a safety copy
with none of the above processors included in the signal path.

[rob sparx]

I hate to rattle on about this but please remember that heavy compression or limiting or over driving plug ins or normalising all create digital artifactcs that will not tranlate to vinyl also if you intend to ever ask anyone to master your tunes it would be advisable to make a safety copy
with none of the above processors included in the signal path.

Driving the sound at the mixing stage is only good for help balancing the mix or getting a tune loud enough to play out before its been mastered. Volume should always be backed off for the premaster recording otherwise theres no headroom for the engineer to work with and a risk they'll overcook the sound.