Friendly Adivce to ALL Producers (Structures)

deapoh · Post by **deapoh** » Fri Jan 05, 2007 7:42 am

I've downloaded loads of tunes from the forum. One thing I find common especially with new producers and that is they don't quite structure tracks well.

You gotta remember your making the tune for the DJ just as much as you are making it for the crowd. 8 bar, 16 bar, 32 bar structures, simple but very clear to follow. Something which can help with your structures is little edits in the tune which guides people through the track.

Obviously you can do what you like, I'm just not following some tracks at all and thought I'd mention this.

dougd · Post by **dougd** » Fri Jan 05, 2007 8:33 am

This is interesting... could you give some examples of the little edits? Do you mean things like buildups, or a sound that repeats like once every 4 bars?

little boh peep · Post by **little boh peep** » Fri Jan 05, 2007 8:37 am

DougD wrote:This is interesting... could you give some examples of the little edits? Do you mean things like buildups, or a sound that repeats like once every 4 bars?

A fill at the end of every other bar, or every fourth bar, for example.

Learning to DJ - if you don't already - teaches you a great deal about how tunes should be structured. Though it's not essential.

shnyde · Post by **shnyde** » Fri Jan 05, 2007 8:40 am

I've sketched out a template project to use each time i start a new tune (using colours and working out the number of bars etc.) and with all your VSTs/effects and that ready loaded

Helps when you're actually writing the tune as sometimes you can get carried away/not make sections long enough.

lucky_strike · Post by **lucky_strike** » Fri Jan 05, 2007 1:00 pm

SHNYDE wrote:I've sketched out a template project to use each time i start a new tune (using colours and working out the number of bars etc.) and with all your VSTs/effects and that ready loaded

Helps when you're actually writing the tune as sometimes you can get carried away/not make sections long enough.

i have a template project also. best way to work.

blk plague · Post by **blk plague** » Fri Jan 05, 2007 2:32 pm

Deapoh wrote:You gotta remember your making the tune for the DJ just as much as you are making it for the crowd. 8 bar, 16 bar, 32 bar structures, simple but very clear to follow.

standard.

misk · Post by **misk** » Fri Jan 05, 2007 4:06 pm

thanks for the friendly advice there D. I have always felt that arrangement is my weakest point. But i've had a lot of help these past few months by certain people here. DJing does help too.

For me it isnt so much the basic structure of a track (16 bar intro, 16 bar break... whatever) as it is the 'little edits' that keep the track interesting, and hold the energy of the track as well.

Learn the rules, and know them so well you can confidantly break them.

lycaon_prod · Post by **lycaon_prod** » Fri Jan 05, 2007 5:29 pm

Misk wrote: Learn the rules, and know so well you can confidantly break them.

for sure.

solid structure is important, but formulaicism is bad news....

fullyrecordingz · Post by **fullyrecordingz** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 6:31 am

BLK PLAGUE wrote:
Deapoh wrote:You gotta remember your making the tune for the DJ just as much as you are making it for the crowd. 8 bar, 16 bar, 32 bar structures, simple but very clear to follow.
standard.

get me.

anyone who dont know about dese things better start catching up lool

Steve AC23 · Post by **Steve AC23** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 1:21 pm

lol @ this thread.

ekaj · Post by **ekaj** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 4:16 pm

I used to hate doing this but now I do it even if the track is not meant to be mixed.. can't help it now.
I think it's good to make tracks DJ friendly anyway.. and I had another point but it's gone so I'll stop typing

misk · Post by **misk** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 5:02 pm

yeah, theres a bit of controversy about making tracks for the DJ versus, making tracks just for art's sake. but if you are going to be making a genre of music, dubstep for example, that you know is played out by DJs, i think you would be doing yourself a disservice if you didnt make it somewhat DJ friendly.

Unless your burial, that is...

spherix · Post by **spherix** » Sun Jan 07, 2007 12:19 pm

i gotta say if your structure is completely random of course any dj is gonna have a shit time playing it but if everyone follows the same standard structure at all times the music becomes a bit boring and stale (kinda like what happened to drum and bass)

structure need sto make sense and be logical and progressive, as long as you follow some rough guidelines a dj should be able to work it out.

i rarely see a dj pull out a tune theyve never heard and try to mix it

rybread · Post by **rybread** » Sun Jan 07, 2007 8:20 pm

How about a couple of really strong dubstep examples of the fills and structure you're talking about. I know what you're talking about (with respect to drum and bass) but I want to hear it too. Try and include the timing marks of the stuff you're talking about.

The strongest example I can think of is Skream-"Midnight Request Line" with that huge key change that lets you know everything is about to change.

drum syndicate · Post by **drum syndicate** » Sun Jan 07, 2007 8:41 pm

perfect example is the pad fill on Reso - No Such Thing as Fate when it drops into that super bubbly trancey riff.

spiro · Post by **spiro** » Sun Jan 07, 2007 9:26 pm

Misk wrote:Learn the rules, and know them so well you can confidantly break them.

thanks for this topic!!!

You ned to have a realy good reason to break the rules.
music is after all basicaly based on math. luckily we dont need to know the math ...
just feel it!!!

.spiro.

flipw · Post by **flipw** » Sun Jan 07, 2007 9:42 pm

can you all put a quiet tick/beep on each beat at the start for about 16/32 beats to assist the dj matching speeds and dropping in?

something helpful like on dmz refix of Fat freddys drop

two oh one · Post by **two oh one** » Sun Jan 07, 2007 9:45 pm

flipw wrote:can you all put a quiet tick/beep on each beat at the start for about 16/32 beats to assist the dj matching speeds and dropping in?

something helpful like on dmz refix of Fat freddys drop

Even better, put a robot voice counting down through in each measure...

flipw · Post by **flipw** » Sun Jan 07, 2007 9:53 pm

two oh one wrote:
flipw wrote:can you all put a quiet tick/beep on each beat at the start for about 16/32 beats to assist the dj matching speeds and dropping in?

something helpful like on dmz refix of Fat freddys drop
Even better, put a robot voice counting down through in each measure...

top idea

also need some sort of warning for bass dropping for sure.

maybe all producers could agree on a bpm: 140 sound ok with everyone?

two oh one · Post by **two oh one** » Sun Jan 07, 2007 10:00 pm

flipw wrote:
two oh one wrote:
flipw wrote:can you all put a quiet tick/beep on each beat at the start for about 16/32 beats to assist the dj matching speeds and dropping in?

something helpful like on dmz refix of Fat freddys drop
Even better, put a robot voice counting down through in each measure...

top idea

also need some sort of warning for bass dropping for sure.

maybe all producers could agree on a bpm: 140 sound ok with everyone?

140 is too limiting. I want to use a tempo of 133bpm going down to 116 randomly, when I see fit.

Friendly Adivce to ALL Producers (Structures)

Friendly Adivce to ALL Producers (Structures)

Re: Friendly Adivce to ALL Producers (Structures)

Re: Friendly Adivce to ALL Producers (Structures)

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