REASON 4 OR FRUITY LOOPS?

[gravity]

Its not full screen cuz your supposed to detach sequencer window. Then put them side by side. To get a better view of whats goin on. And it doesnt support plugins, butt plugs, Vst's, Abc's or 123's cuz it already comes with three synthesizers that can be manipulated to ur liking. And possibilities are only limited by ur imagination. And the size of ur processor. Now go play wit ur sytrus or mango synths

fl built in stuff is gash too. but vsti's>any built in reason bullshit. and where is your audio in reason? oh wait you have to buy that piece of shit record dont you? hardcore reason heads make me laugh even more than hardcore fruity heads.

cubase wins btw.

No you dont need record unless u plan to play a live guitar or some real instruments. And record is not shit. Ive seen peeps use it to remix a tune on the fly. I dont use or need it. You dont need audio in cuz u got what u need in there. U sayin that reasons built in synths is bullshit? These are basically virtual sythesizers. They do the exact ting a real one would do so how is that bullshit??????? What makes me laugh is the amount of HARDCORE REASON HATERS THAT EXIST. That and fruity loops. And cubase??? Cant comment on what I dont know about. Then Id be jus like every other hater in here. And Ill leave wit a qoute from NAS "NIKKAS FEAR WHAT THEY DONT UNDERSTAND, HATE WHAT THEY CANT CONQUER. GUESS ITS JUST THE FURY OF MAN"

i am indeed saying the synths are a bit poo, especially when you compare them to things like gladiator or absynth 4, and the samplers are even more shit compared to kontakt, and the effects are even worse when you compare them to things like the fabfilter plugs or altiverb or amplitube. you dont need audio but wait till you try it... audio is fantastic. imagine the power if you can.. i can click on some and reverse it, pitch shift it, put effects on it, chop and rearrange it, timestretch it, all in a matter of seconds. i am not a hardcore reason hater... i believe that you can make wicked tunes in reason (one of my mates was always a fucking don on reason) but i also believe you are making life unnecessarily difficult for yourself. and there is one thing i like about reason - the vocoder. anyway, im commenting on things i do know about, ive spent time with most sequencers bar logic and reaper really, and of the lot reason is the worst in my opinion.

The synths are poo in there raw form. Thats why you gotta tweak em. Everting in there can be tweaked to what u need. Its not like click this and tada you have the best synth ever. The sampler has reverse and pitch shift. You can create amazing effects. Looks to me that your opinion is based on what you and your mate couldnt accomplish. Hence the reason your on about cubase. Everybody has there right to there opinion. Instead of putting reason down because you couldnt create what you wanted you should just say "I couldnt figure reason out". Everyone always wants to be the winner. And defeat is not easily accepted. Well I could go on battling for days but for what. I like how FRUITY LOOPS users dont take the time to explain there side of the story and just come in and say FRUITY LOOPS RAPES AND SCRAPES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Oh well its like arguing with a woman. You take your time to explain. It jus gos in one ear and out the other. So Ive put in my two cents. I dont need to convince you how good reason is. And you dont need to convince me about fruity or cubase. So to each there own PEACE

mate im not a spastic i know how to program a synth but there is a thing called a 'quality' and every synth has its own 'quality', even software synths, and the quality of reasons synths aint that good. wooo the sampler has a reverse and pitch shift.... woop de fucking doo. kontakt has about 15 different types of filters (which all sound better than reasons i may add), distortions, total control of loop points, 3 different granular modes, built in sample chopping if you need to use it, eqs, reverbs, delays, choruses, etc. all completely modular so you can link literally anything to an envelope, lfo, external cc, velocity, envelope follower, whatever. i can quite happily use reason, id just rather not. btw my mate has an exclusive contract with a label, has been smashing venues, is doing official remixes of some rather large dubstep artists, and is doing pretty fucking well for himself actually (btw he uses live as well now), but i dunno why you brought him into it because i said that he does wicked stuff with reason, and i wasnt denying that you could, but its still not as good as cubase or even fruity.

im not a fruityloops user, havent been for quite a while now, but i still reckon its better than reason for the simple fact that you can use plugins and its sound engine doesnt colour stuff half as much as reasons does. which it does, and if you dont believe me do a search, there have been proper tests that prove reason taints your sound.

anyway i dunno why im bothering, its like talking to a brick wall.

[Bad Lux]

I like when people say they got releases on labels. Then u look them up and its a b side that was thrown in there jus as a filler for good measure. Not that ur mate fits this category. Jus sayin. All these plugins you listed can be achieved in anyting you create in reason. Since you are very familiar with reason you should know this. And since there has been tests from the association of sucky sound or A.S.S then looks like me and whoever else uses reason is doomed!!!!
Honestly I just love music. I dont care if you got the best or worst software. My goal is to make what I like. No matter if its inferior as long as I got one of these on my face Cheers to all Now forget the beef and start makin some so we can all and enjoy. Sir gravity where can I go to listen to your tunes????? Peace

[gravity]

I like when people say they got releases on labels. Then u look them up and its a b side that was thrown in there jus as a filler for good measure. Not that ur mate fits this category. Jus sayin. All these plugins you listed can be achieved in anyting you create in reason. Since you are very familiar with reason you should know this. And since there has been tests from the association of sucky sound or A.S.S then looks like me and whoever else uses reason is doomed!!!!
Honestly I just love music. I dont care if you got the best or worst software. My goal is to make what I like. No matter if its inferior as long as I got one of these on my face Cheers to all Now forget the beef and start makin some so we can all and enjoy. Sir gravity where can I go to listen to your tunes????? Peace

look up culprate mate, he's gonna be big soon, at the moment he is remixing fucking datsik and koan sound, and getting datsik, flux pavillion, etc remixing his stuff. dont make assumptions mate. and i still dunno why you are bringing him into it, i said repeatedly now that he does good stuff with reason. you said its like arguing with a woman and yet it seems to be you who isnt listening to what is being said. are you fucking retarded?

btw you can listen to my tunes if you use your fucking eyes and look in my sig for links yeah...? where can i hear yours eh?

[JFK]

look up culprate mate, he's gonna be big soon

+1 "Trench Foot" fucking kills it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m01L_r8G6x0

at the moment he is remixing fucking datsik and koan sound

Cant wait! Got release dates or anything bruv? Are they on his Myspace?

[serox]

I have recently started a new project in Reason 4 after using FL8/9 for ages. I seem to be much better at putting combinators together and layering things up to produce some nice big sounds. All the things I hated about Reason before are no longer!

I am once again forcing myself to use the Subtraktor alone and getting some nice results. Using a basic synth for basic waveforms but its all about the processing;)

[serox]

I like when people say they got releases on labels. Then u look them up and its a b side that was thrown in there jus as a filler for good measure. Not that ur mate fits this category.

Or its released on a label you have never heard of and they sold 10 mp3s hehe,

[kejk]

I've used Reason for the past 5 years, and I love it.

The only things that are not there are VST/VSTi plug-ins and real audio processing.

Limits are good. Limits make you creative. Think about it.


EDIT: I have to add, FL probably has the best piano roll editor I've ever used.

[serox]

Limits are good. Limits make you creative. Think about it.

THIS!

This is why old music is better

They really took the time to learn how to use that box and made decent grooves and decent sounds! with too many options available people dont seem to be making stuff as good I think

[serox]

EDIT: I have to add, FL probably has the best piano roll editor I've ever used.

Why?

[kejk]

EDIT: I have to add, FL probably has the best piano roll editor I've ever used.

Why?

Because you basicly don't have to use your keyboard. In Reason you have to use the Q,W,E keys to swap tools, and hold ctrl to duplicate a note.

[serox]

Because you basicly don't have to use your keyboard. In Reason you have to use the Q,W,E keys to swap tools, and hold ctrl to duplicate a note.

I work much faster in Reason because of the use of both keyboard and mouse! I dont use the keyboard to swap tools I use the mouse while I use my hand for cTRL when needed.

I hate FLs piano roll lol.

[kejk]

Because you basicly don't have to use your keyboard. In Reason you have to use the Q,W,E keys to swap tools, and hold ctrl to duplicate a note.

I work much faster in Reason because of the use of both keyboard and mouse! I dont use the keyboard to swap tools I use the mouse while I use my hand for cTRL when needed.

I hate FLs piano roll lol.

I also work faster in Reason, but that's because, like I said, have used it for the past 5 years.

I just know for a fact that the FL sequencer/piano roll is really good.

[gravity]

Cant wait! Got release dates or anything bruv? Are they on his Myspace?

no idea dude, went round his gaff the other weekend and he was in the middle of doing the koan sound one, i heard the datsik remix a couple of weeks ago, mechano i think...?

[KryptonDubstep]

i went from FL to reason 4 about 7 months ago and i've found the sounds i'm getting are alot better.
not a fan of VST's myself.
Reason!

[yellowhighlighter]

mate im not a spastic i know how to program a synth but there is a thing called a 'quality' and every synth has its own 'quality', even software synths, and the quality of reasons synths aint that good. wooo the sampler has a reverse and pitch shift.... woop de fucking doo. kontakt has about 15 different types of filters (which all sound better than reasons i may add), distortions, total control of loop points, 3 different granular modes, built in sample chopping if you need to use it, eqs, reverbs, delays, choruses, etc. all completely modular so you can link literally anything to an envelope, lfo, external cc, velocity, envelope follower, whatever. i can quite happily use reason, id just rather not. btw my mate has an exclusive contract with a label, has been smashing venues, is doing official remixes of some rather large dubstep artists, and is doing pretty fucking well for himself actually (btw he uses live as well now), but i dunno why you brought him into it because i said that he does wicked stuff with reason, and i wasnt denying that you could, but its still not as good as cubase or even fruity.

im not a fruityloops user, havent been for quite a while now, but i still reckon its better than reason for the simple fact that you can use plugins and its sound engine doesnt colour stuff half as much as reasons does. which it does, and if you dont believe me do a search, there have been proper tests that prove reason taints your sound.

anyway i dunno why im bothering, its like talking to a brick wall.

gravity i wasn't going to respond and say anything to you but then i read something you posted in another thread and it just made the eyes roll into the back of my head.

i mean everybody on production forums likes to flex their muscles in terms of knowledge but i think it leads to a lot of general confusion because people start assuming that the software which is the most feature laden (however well they're implemented) is automatically the best.

the more bloated a piece of software becomes the more likely it becomes that the software itself will become unnecessarily difficult to navigate.

i think a huge problem in these arguments is that people start discussing things as if this was fantasy land and they start forgetting that we live in reality. in fantasy land something with lots of features is automatically better because you can potentially do more with it. but unfortunately we live in reality land and a lot of people don't want or need shit loads of features so what we can effectively call the "best" (which is generally impossible anyway because it all just depends on the individual at the end of the day) becomes a lot harder to judge as different people need and want different things.

to say something like all the 15 filters in kontakt are better than those in reason is ridiculous. how "good" a filter sounds is entirely down to personal preference. you should also mention that applying effects such as delay, reverb and eq can be done in reason also. just because the effects don't exist in the sampler that doesn't mean that you can for whatever reason apply effects to your sampler's output.

if you want to talk about different DAWs colouring the sound, from what i know it is the reason mixer that actually colours the sound (there is actually a switch on the back of it) and this has been proven through rewiring using a mixer and without. and AFAIK the new Record mixer sounds fantastic and i've only heard great things about its sound quality. but again this is fantasy versus reality talk.

gravity do you want to see if you can tell the difference between three songs bounced from reason 4, cubase and flstudio? are you confident you can say which sounds worse? are you confident you will be able to tell which came from reason?

anyway this is my mini-rant over. i don't mean to call you out or anything but if there's one thing that annoys me it's those diehard propellerheads fanboys but if there's one thing that annoys me more it's those people who just want to bash reason for no reason whatsoever.

i don't use reason btw but i have used it a lot and i really like it. IMO it offers a different way of working when compared to other sequencers, not necessarily better or worse, just different.

ps that Bad Lux guy is obviously retarded or something so i don't really know why somebody would bother arguing with him.

[therapist]

definately reason 4, but that may be because i never have used fruityloops...

Well done mate, really.

[gravity]

gravity i wasn't going to respond and say anything to you but then i read something you posted in another thread and it just made the eyes roll into the back of my head.

quite possible mate i am known for babbling shit on (and off) forums, often i dont think before i open my mouth/press keys and i openly admit it!

i mean everybody on production forums likes to flex their muscles in terms of knowledge but i think it leads to a lot of general confusion because people start assuming that the software which is the most feature laden (however well they're implemented) is automatically the best.

the more bloated a piece of software becomes the more likely it becomes that the software itself will become unnecessarily difficult to navigate.

from my experience this is not strictly true. obviously there is gonna be a bit more of a learning curve with the larger more fully fledged sequencers, but given that little bit of extra time/effort to learn these tools properly (or in fact even just to the degree that you need really) the workflow is no more difficult, and in fact often more intuitive once you understand it. i used to think that cubase was incredibly daunting, but now i dont think i could go back to something like like fl because it seems incredibly limited and cumbersome in comparison. obviously i am only speaking for myself here, but i cant be arsed to put IMO, IME, or whatever in front of every claim i make. surely everything i state is in my opinion or in my experience unless stated otherwise?

i think a huge problem in these arguments is that people start discussing things as if this was fantasy land and they start forgetting that we live in reality. in fantasy land something with lots of features is automatically better because you can potentially do more with it. but unfortunately we live in reality land and a lot of people don't want or need shit loads of features so what we can effectively call the "best" (which is generally impossible anyway because it all just depends on the individual at the end of the day) becomes a lot harder to judge as different people need and want different things.

fair enough

to say something like all the 15 filters in kontakt are better than those in reason is ridiculous. how "good" a filter sounds is entirely down to personal preference. you should also mention that applying effects such as delay, reverb and eq can be done in reason also. just because the effects don't exist in the sampler that doesn't mean that you can for whatever reason apply effects to your sampler's output.

again the whole imo/ime thing. obviously it is only in my opinion that the filters sound better in kontakt than reason. but surely thats what the thread is asking for... peoples opinions on what is better, no? and yes of course you can add effects in reason, but not in the reason samplers - which was kind of my point... you can internally control/modulate these things from within the sampler, which gives a larger scope for sound design. and i know you can do all the modular routing and what have you in reason too, which (IME/IMO/etc.) is a bigger pain in the ass for the most part.

if you want to talk about different DAWs colouring the sound, from what i know it is the reason mixer that actually colours the sound (there is actually a switch on the back of it) and this has been proven through rewiring using a mixer and without. and AFAIK the new Record mixer sounds fantastic and i've only heard great things about its sound quality. but again this is fantasy versus reality talk.

ok, i wasnt aware of that (mixer thing), the tests i have seen (well, the one i can recall from the various ones i have seen) basically involved people bouncing a raw sine wave from one of the reason synths (dunno which) and another synth and comparing them - basically reason was a lot less accurate. cant be arsed to find it now.

gravity do you want to see if you can tell the difference between three songs bounced from reason 4, cubase and flstudio? are you confident you can say which sounds worse? are you confident you will be able to tell which came from reason?

not particularly, but i'd have a go. the point i was trying to make is that you have to work a lot harder in something like reason to get a decent quality sound. i wasn't denying that you could (as i stated repeatedly).

anyway this is my mini-rant over. i don't mean to call you out or anything but if there's one thing that annoys me it's those diehard propellerheads fanboys but if there's one thing that annoys me more it's those people who just want to bash reason for no reason whatsoever.

tbh i couldnt really care what sequencer people use, im not really a reason hater. i just dont like it myself. as i stated before, you can get good results out of it.

i don't use reason btw but i have used it a lot and i really like it. IMO it offers a different way of working when compared to other sequencers, not necessarily better or worse, just different.

fair enough

ps that Bad Lux guy is obviously retarded or something so i don't really know why somebody would bother arguing with him.

out of severe boredom to be honest. if he had responded to my post in a civilized manner like you have then the discussion would have stayed civilized.

anyways, safe! its actually quite nice to have a non-aggy discussion about these things.

[JFK]

definately reason 4, but that may be because i never have used fruityloops...

Well done mate, really.

[Bad Lux]

I dont know how I responded in an uncivilized manner?? Im not the one callin you retard like a 16 year old school girl. Guess Im supposed to be offended or get my feelings hurt cuz u got ur pantys ina bunch. All because I decided to try to explain that reason isnt the lame software that you took many a replys to prove to everyone. I tink everyting I have debated about has been very civilized. Id understand if I was calin u retarded or tryin to make myself look better by using my mates cred to make me shine. And I wasnt bringin him up anymore. I was jus sayin in general. I guess if someone stands up to a bully they end up lookin like a retard? Or if there opinion differs from everyone elses. Dont matter to me. Im still here sayin what I gotta say. Peace

[gravity]

I dont know how I responded in an uncivilized manner?? Im not the one callin you retard like a 16 year old school girl. Guess Im supposed to be offended or get my feelings hurt cuz u got ur pantys ina bunch. All because I decided to try to explain that reason isnt the lame software that you took many a replys to prove to everyone. I tink everyting I have debated about has been very civilized.

ok, lets have a look at this then:

Its not full screen cuz your supposed to detach sequencer window. Then put them side by side. To get a better view of whats goin on. And it doesnt support plugins, butt plugs, Vst's, Abc's or 123's cuz it already comes with three synthesizers that can be manipulated to ur liking. And possibilities are only limited by ur imagination. And the size of ur processor. Now go play wit ur sytrus or mango synths

bit condescending eh? hence the condescending responses. so lets look at your next response...

No you dont need record unless u plan to play a live guitar or some real instruments. And record is not shit. Ive seen peeps use it to remix a tune on the fly. I dont use or need it. You dont need audio in cuz u got what u need in there. U sayin that reasons built in synths is bullshit? These are basically virtual sythesizers. They do the exact ting a real one would do so how is that bullshit??????? What makes me laugh is the amount of HARDCORE REASON HATERS THAT EXIST. That and fruity loops. And cubase??? Cant comment on what I dont know about. Then Id be jus like every other hater in here. And Ill leave wit a qoute from NAS "NIKKAS FEAR WHAT THEY DONT UNDERSTAND, HATE WHAT THEY CANT CONQUER. GUESS ITS JUST THE FURY OF MAN

even more condescending. paricularly this bit: " Cant comment on what I dont know about. Then Id be jus like every other hater in here. And Ill leave wit a qoute from NAS "NIKKAS FEAR WHAT THEY DONT UNDERSTAND, HATE WHAT THEY CANT CONQUER. GUESS ITS JUST THE FURY OF MAN" - i actually know how to use reason dude, just because i dont like it doesnt mean i cant bloody use it. hence the even more condescending responses. build from there really

Id understand if I was calin u retarded or tryin to make myself look better by using my mates cred to make me shine. And I wasnt bringin him up anymore. I was jus sayin in general. I guess if someone stands up to a bully they end up lookin like a retard? Or if there opinion differs from everyone elses. Dont matter to me. Im still here sayin what I gotta say. Peace

i was using him as an example of how you can do good things with reason, which you repeatedly ignored/took out of context. i wasnt actually trying to use him for credibility in any way at all. then you started attacking him...

Looks to me that your opinion is based on what you and your mate couldnt accomplish.

and then this

I like when people say they got releases on labels. Then u look them up and its a b side that was thrown in there jus as a filler for good measure

so i defended him. because he is a mate.