Who thinks zeitgeist is on to something?

[theevilgirl]

i actually find both Zeitgeist Movies very interesting and seemingly accurate.

I mean if 9-11 wasn't staged...HOW would those buildings fall the way they did? The beams melted? really?....let's say they did....there is no way the heat would have traveled so far down to melt nearly the entire building...or even warm up the structure to fall the way it did and even if half the building melted...how would the rest fall?...cuz of the pressure from the top part?...it held on this long the density of the upper portion hasn't changed, just the area it takes up. If it were just merely a plane hitting a building...THAT building...it may have caught fire in a section but there is no way the entire building would fall like that.

Do you mind me asking what experience or education in the construction industry you have to come to that conclusion?

ive worked on my dads construction sites....he used to build on ground level in buildings in manhattan....

and its sensible i mean ...the steel posts would most likely protrude outword rather than fall straight down.... this is my theory...

Haha, POW! As was said above. Still, I've done a fair bit of labouring in my time, and I know next to nothing about building construction.

But I do believe that if the top few floors of a large sky scraper were to collapse, then the sheer mass of the top section falling down onto the rest of it, combined with momentum and accelaration under the force of gravity, would cause the building to collapse vertically, which would no doubt look like a controlled demolition.

I think we're probably going to go around in circles with this. I think the conspiracy theories are a fucking joke, and you probably consider me to be a dismissive prick. I guess we are both sticking to what we believe in, which for me is physics and some faith in humanity.

trust i am not trying to dismiss your ideas/beliefs/theories/facts...i always try to understand what others are telling me by questioning it...im not looking for the right or wrong answer, just the logic behind it.

we can sit here and make jokes all day but sometimes we should work our minds a little...rather than dismissing it cuz its not fun. i wish i was this way in school, i woulda learned a lot more.

[kins83]

faith in humanity.

now that is some bullshit

[deamonds]

exactly, i just think discussing it is futile, as its not going to change, no matter how much you want it too..

if this was school id be waving my hand in the air saying "miss miss, my pen has somehow got trown out the window, can i go & get it"

[kins83]

exactly, i just think discussing it is futile, as its not going to change, no matter how much you want it too..

That's a very good point. In most science, there is data that can be collected, hypotheses that can be tested and proven/dismissed by various, impartial groups, until an answer is arrived at where no one can question the facts and accepts it as truth.

With conspiracy theories, there is no evidence to analyse 'cept for a few grainy photos, videos, eye witness accounts etc. And the people that carry out the analysis of that data - which is by no means watertight anyway - are by no means unbiased either (in either camp, I should add). As such no indisputable findings can ever come of it and so the debates, arguements and sniping continues indefinitely.

[deamonds]

and when it gets to that point where you find out everything..

you: "gasp!"

*2 shots from a silenced 45*

*body hits the floor & is dragged away*

[whineo]

Its an interesting watch
and i suppose any film that gets people questioning these areas is a good thing
the narrator is just really arrogant in his delivery and just ruins the integrity of the information.

[kins83]

and when it gets to that point where you find out everything..

you: "gasp!"

*2 shots from a silenced 45*

*body hits the floor & is dragged away*

[metalboxproducts]

exactly, i just think discussing it is futile, as its not going to change, no matter how much you want it too..

That's a very good point. In most science, there is data that can be collected, hypotheses that can be tested and proven/dismissed by various, impartial groups, until an answer is arrived at where no one can question the facts and accepts it as truth.

With conspiracy theories, there is no evidence to analyse 'cept for a few grainy photos, videos, eye witness accounts etc. And the people that carry out the analysis of that data - which is by no means watertight anyway - are by no means unbiased either (in either camp, I should add). As such no indisputable findings can ever come of it and so the debates, arguements and sniping continues indefinitely.

75% of data in controlled scientific experiments is completely unexplainable. Now, can you imagine, with all the billions of variables going on on that day how hard it would be to come to some solid explanation of what happened. Most of the things mentioned such as the towers coming down in the fashion they did are completely open to interpritation. What happened had never happened before, it was completely unpresedented. And NONE of us could say, wether expert or lay, how a building of such mass would come down.

[kins83]

exactly, i just think discussing it is futile, as its not going to change, no matter how much you want it too..

That's a very good point. In most science, there is data that can be collected, hypotheses that can be tested and proven/dismissed by various, impartial groups, until an answer is arrived at where no one can question the facts and accepts it as truth.

With conspiracy theories, there is no evidence to analyse 'cept for a few grainy photos, videos, eye witness accounts etc. And the people that carry out the analysis of that data - which is by no means watertight anyway - are by no means unbiased either (in either camp, I should add). As such no indisputable findings can ever come of it and so the debates, arguements and sniping continues indefinitely.

75% of data in controlled scientific experiments is completely unexplainable. Now, can you imagine, with all the billions of variables going on on that day how hard it would be to come to some solid explanation of what happened. Most of the things mentioned such as the towers coming down in the fashion they did are completely open to interpritation. What happened had never happened before, it was completely unpresedented. And NONE of us could say, wether expert or lay, how a building of such mass would come down.

I agree wholeheartedly mate. Too many variables and not enough data, of good enough quality, of all those variables for any meaningful scientific assessment. I guess that adds to the point I was trying to make really, that a 100% watertight conclusion is unattainable. Not sure what you mean by that first sentence though?

[metalboxproducts]

well, what i meant was that even in a lab, under extreamly controlled conditions where all the variables have been accounted for the vast majority of data/events are basically a mystery. So it is little wonder that so many unexplained things occurred on 9/11. It wasn't exactly a controlled experiment now was it? Im sure some people will say that is was indeed a controlled experiment though. lol

[kwality]

I don't buy into everything the film suggests (and I had my doubts long before seeing it) but I do think that as the major catalyst for change in our lifetime, there really should be no questions left.

Think about all that has changed since that one day in September - there should really be no questions, no doubts, no grey areas. The ship has already sailed, but it's sad that we're still so far from the truth.

I feel for everyone even remotely involved, and appreciate those who believe it was a terrorist act. But aren't even they confused as to why the official commission was such a farce? Why was there so little money given to it when private contractors in Iraq are paid billions in no bid contracts? Why was there no scramble on the day when 4 planes were miles off course? How the hell did they get to the pentagon? Why the hell did the terrorists have passports on a domestic flight, and how the hell were they still in one piece after the event? Why have the people involved in the rescue efforts been treated like lepers since? What happened to wtc 7? Why was the site shut down before real examination could take place?

A film like this shouldn't be the issue - the issue should be that this act has changed all our lives in immeasurable ways, yet there are still some very real and very large questions present.

[Coppola]

i really want to see this now. has anyone got a streaming link?

[theaccuria]

You can download it for free or stream it from their site.

www.google.com

[fuagofire]

yeah the two things i didn't like about the film was the 9/11 bit and part 3,
it might have been possible that the yankgov knew it was going to happen and didn't do anything about it to use it as a political tool and the current financial system is pretty stupid in the sense that it does lock people up in finance and get bastards rich regardless of the fact we have a limited amount of stuff on the planet to survive long term but i don't think its a conspiracy - thats pretty obvious what would the point of the super rich trying to get more power? they can do pretty much what the fuck they want anyway.
its sad as it is we cant run the planet a bit more sensibly but i think putting 2 and 2 together and getting 5 is what this film is guilty of.
having said that, the best way to cover up a conspiracy would be a conspiracy theory.

[nousd]

I reckon it'd only be one in twenty of us that'd be unscrupulous,
if that.
Most people are reasonable and principled (when sober)
Essentially that's why I'm leery of conspiracies:
most people wouldn't participate in murkiness (when straight).

[freshmc]

Find your own spirituality, earn what you can to stay on the map, eat whatever the hell you want, create as much as possible and ingest large amounts of jacked up wobbly subbass at regular intervals. Walk your own path. Booka bom booka.

[Hibbie]

Seriously late on this one but i've only just been bothered to watch this today. Gotta say that Out if the 3 parts the christianity and the banking parts raise serious good points. But i think it's quite funny how people are going on about 9/11 being staged, I think to a that to a certain extent the US government may have some sort of connection but when people are talking about planted explosions and there not actually being a plain that hit the pentagon.....
Also the whole molten steel business, surely it was the aluminium from what the plain was made out off, aluminium has quite a low melting point.
I suppose the majority of people that think the 9/11 attacks were staged also believe we didn't go to the moon.

[alien pimp]

faith in humanity.

now that is some bullshit

so what exactly in the state of affairs 2010 years after christ do you find fueling that faith?

[alfie]

i fundamentally reject the idea of a controlling human elite, because i'm a human and i know what we're like. there's no-one at the rudder of this chaotic world

people turn up to work hungover, make pillow talk with their wives, secrets emerge and one that big would be the same

as for 9/11....my opinion is that it was a terrorist attack, but one that the us government had a certain level of knowledge about and used for political reasons

[seckle]

exactly, i just think discussing it is futile, as its not going to change, no matter how much you want it too..

That's a very good point. In most science, there is data that can be collected, hypotheses that can be tested and proven/dismissed by various, impartial groups, until an answer is arrived at where no one can question the facts and accepts it as truth.

With conspiracy theories, there is no evidence to analyse 'cept for a few grainy photos, videos, eye witness accounts etc. And the people that carry out the analysis of that data - which is by no means watertight anyway - are by no means unbiased either (in either camp, I should add). As such no indisputable findings can ever come of it and so the debates, arguements and sniping continues indefinitely.

agree with both of you. The burden of proof is on zeitgiest, and so far theyve come up short as expected. Their film is very compelling, and thought provoking, but as far as supporting allegations....its all smoke and mirrors. The wtc was not an inside job. I saw those towers fall with my own eyes.


75% of data in controlled scientific experiments is completely unexplainable. Now, can you imagine, with all the billions of variables going on on that day how hard it would be to come to some solid explanation of what happened. Most of the things mentioned such as the towers coming down in the fashion they did are completely open to interpritation. What happened had never happened before, it was completely unpresedented. And NONE of us could say, wether expert or lay, how a building of such mass would come down.

I agree wholeheartedly mate. Too many variables and not enough data, of good enough quality, of all those variables for any meaningful scientific assessment. I guess that adds to the point I was trying to make really, that a 100% watertight conclusion is unattainable. Not sure what you mean by that first sentence though?