Dealing with really low sub (and hangover tips)

[HALP]

yeah i get that

but i find it "safer" to just turn op the volume on the sub, then to do compression
might not be the best thing to do, ill try it out sometime

[deadly_habit]

yeah i get that

but i find it "safer" to just turn op the volume on the sub, then to do compression
might not be the best thing to do, ill try it out sometime

here an example
collab i'm doing
subtleness with compression is key
http://www.mediafire.com/?n2mik1nvy00
i kept dynamics in it but squashed main sub and orig line to be same db level

[HALP]

thanks for the example, i feel like i'm learning stuff and learning = good (stay in school)

I"m not sure i'm hearing (in the track) what you said about squashing them so they're at the same db's
with mixing you would be able to do the same right?

So what stands out for me is squashing the dynamics a little bit, to get an overall fuller sub.
Wich is interesting, but i always tend to do this with lfo > volume options
and just keep those low, limiting the dynamic range as well i guess

last question hopefully, did you use compression instead of the technique i described above because of choice or because of other reasons?

just curious

thanks for the insights

[deadly_habit]

like i said fletcher munson and open a spectral analyzer or just watch db levels playing a pure sine at low keys
and watch how the dbs lower note by note

[HALP]

aaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhh
yes didnt think about it like that

thanks

[nowaysj]

like i said fletcher munson and open a spectral analyzer or just watch db levels playing a pure sine at low keys
and watch how the dbs lower note by note

Okay, just loaded up sytrus w/ a sin, played descending notes, didn't see any drop in db all the way down into the inaudible bass ranges.

[Sharmaji]

but how is having dynamics in the sub range a bad thing?

it's not-- but it does change the phsyical experience of it. Really compressing/limiting a sub can impart a lot of tension into the sound-- you won't really hear it, but you'll feel it at 105db in a club. Conversely, leaving it open and letting it breathe may SOUND nearly the same, but will feel different.

[SunkLo]

Wouldn't compression even out the bass notes according to dBs and not compensate for Fletcher Munson? You'd still need an eq curve afterwards to get the lowest notes to sound equal to the higher ones.
I'm really tired though so maybe that's why this doesn't make sense to me

[macc]

like i said fletcher munson and open a spectral analyzer or just watch db levels playing a pure sine at low keys
and watch how the dbs lower note by note

Okay, just loaded up sytrus w/ a sin, played descending notes, didn't see any drop in db all the way down into the inaudible bass ranges.

You shouldn't, Deadly's talking rubbish there.

Fletcher Munson is a psychoacoustic phenomenon, not a physical one. Point being that as your note descends at exactly the same amplitude, it will sound quieter and quieter. So in order to make a lower note appear as loud, you need to turn it up more. This is what the Fletcher Munson (equal loudness) curves show.

Use headphones for trying this though as your room is likely so uneven down there that it makes it all pointless anyway.

You shouldn't be worrying about Fletcher Munson or anything like that when you're mixing. It's already taken care of because you are a human being . Make it sound right (watching for room issues of course) and don't think about it. Trying to over-intellectualise and second guessing yourself based on misunderstood things you read on the internet is a wrong'un

[macc]

Wouldn't compression even out the bass notes according to dBs and not compensate for Fletcher Munson? You'd still need an eq curve afterwards to get the lowest notes to sound equal to the higher ones.

[Basic A]

Im not sure but we need to learn how to deal with this shit fast!!!

Imagine an enemy that learns how to use your body’s natural defenses to kill you. And, by doing so, they can cause your death in a way that is untraceable and that will always be attributed to natural causes. That potentially deadly natural defense exists within each of our bodies. And, as the following will show, research is now being done to find ways to turn our bodies normally protective functions into a sleeping assassin that can be triggered by government agents or law enforcement. The intent is to cause death by untraceable causes. Indeed, that research is the basis for my story at badexperiment.com

Infrasound are sound waves that are felt by the body rather than heard. For example, have you ever observed how very deep bass notes on a powerful sound system can be felt as they pulse through your body? Ultra low bass notes that can only be felt are part of the infrasound spectrum. This is sound that is silent, below the range of human hearing. What happens when the human body is assaulted with infrasound repeatedly over long periods of time? Depending upon the amplitude or intensity, it produces feelings of extreme discomfort, a feeling that the body is vibrating. Such feelings intensify as the level of infrasound is increased. In effect, infrasound in the right hands, can serve as a weapon of torture. There are other effects that can enhance infrasounds’ use as a weapon of torture. Depending upon the frequency and intensity, infrasound can keep you awake, or, induce sleep. Therefore, it can serve as a remote means of causing sleep deprivation. Infrasound also has a deteriorating effect on work performance similar to alcohol ingestion. An excellent British research paper providing a synopsis of current research on infrasound’s effect on humans can be found at this link.

However, there is one effect of infrasound that can prove deadly during long-term exposure. Infrasound induces stress and causes the body to secrete the hormone Cortisol. This effect is a medically recognized danger of long-term infrasound exposure (see research paper link above). In fact, exposure to infrasound during sleep also stimulates Cortisol production by the body. Why is infrasound’s’ effect on Cortisol so significant?

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Remotely targeted infrasound weapons showers victims with silent, focused soundwaves in their homes (infrasound easily passes through walls and all building materials). When exposure to infrasound is prolonged, it becomes a slow kill murder weapon. Indeed, an untraceable murder weapon, as it leaves no evidence of its use on the victim. Infrasound becomes particularly deadly if it is used during the victim’s early morning sleep hours. Why? This is the period of time when the body normally produces the lowest levels of Cortisol. Artificially stimulating Cortisol production during this time disrupts the body’s’ normal Cortisol production in the worst possible way. In effect, the sleeping body perceives infrasound as a threat and elevates Cortisol production to cope. Since the victim is asleep, the Cortisol is not used, and remains in the body, damaging life-essential body functions. If a weapon producing silent infrasound is targeted at a victim for months, or even years, how long will it take for it to cause the victims’ death through deadly health complications? That appears to be a key question currently being researched by Federal / Military covert testing of through-the-wall infrasound weapons involuntarily on American Citizens.

My experience as a long-term victim of though-the-wall infrasound weapons shows that my torturers most commonly these devices during the early morning sleep hours. Also during the day, they are constantly creating stress-inducing incidents to elevate Cortisol levels as well. In effect, I’ve become the victim of unending 24 hour, 7 day-a-week chronic stress that has lasted for more than a decade. Make no mistake about it, my antagonist’s ultimate motive is to cause death.

However, infrasound weapons are used in conjunction with microwave (or millimeter wave) through-the-wall weapons that have a specific effect on brain activity. In what way do the two weapon systems work together to amplify the effects of stress on the body? Stay tuned for the next installment in the Weapons Series.

Read more: http://www.darkgovernment.com/news/infr ... z0ojvUu9N7

[deadly_habit]

Wouldn't compression even out the bass notes according to dBs and not compensate for Fletcher Munson? You'd still need an eq curve afterwards to get the lowest notes to sound equal to the higher ones.

me and you arguing on of all points bass
the irony
listen to macc over me any day
hes written some of the hardest hitting basslines around

[HALP]

i seriously questioned my own judgement for a minute, haha
Buttt i did learn something today, and i'm gonna try it out soon
Which is
cutting at 30 with a boost just before, see how that sounds

[deadly_habit]

i seriously questioned my own judgement for a minute, haha
Buttt i did learn something today, and i'm gonna try it out soon
Which is
cutting at 30 with a boost just before, see how that sounds

experiment man
best way to gain knowledge

[ajfa]

but how is having dynamics in the sub range a bad thing?

it's not-- but it does change the phsyical experience of it. Really compressing/limiting a sub can impart a lot of tension into the sound-- you won't really hear it, but you'll feel it at 105db in a club. Conversely, leaving it open and letting it breathe may SOUND nearly the same, but will feel different.

Just wondering are you referring to a pure sine sub? i understand what you mean if you're referring to a sub that has harmonics or some detuning going on (like those old jungly type subs) but not really sure how this works for a sine sub. Do you mean compressing/limiting to kind of drive the sub to give some harmonics or what? Isn't the dB on that going to be constant anyway?

[Snafu]

I just kicked the multiband compressor out of my master channel. It seriously messed up my sub. With the multiband it created some sort of distortion effect that sounded crap and made the sub loose power. Now I just have some light EQ and soft limiting on my master. Its a bit less loud but the sub sounds nice and sits well. Is there any way to get a multiband to work with subs? I might just have to use one that lets me deactivate the LOW bands. It seems to add a lot of punch to my midrange.. I would like to keep it in there. (Ohh yeah, Im using a pure sine from massiv)

Ohh and thanks again for all of this knowledge!

[staticcast]

I just kicked the multiband compressor out of my master channel. It seriously messed up my sub. With the multiband it created some sort of distortion effect that sounded crap and made the sub loose power. Now I just have some light EQ and soft limiting on my master. Its a bit less loud but the sub sounds nice and sits well. Is there any way to get a multiband to work with subs? I might just have to use one that lets me deactivate the LOW bands. It seems to add a lot of punch to my midrange.. I would like to keep it in there. (Ohh yeah, Im using a pure sine from massiv)

Ohh and thanks again for all of this knowledge!

IMHO, IME, etc: multibands = best left to mastering engineers and people who really know what they're doing, otherwise they do more harm than good. I wouldn't put one on a sub. If you wanna compress different bits of your bass synth separately, I'd use different synths on different channels.

EDIT: you should be able to deactivate the Low band on your multiband, though, no?

[fhsueh]

Stay tuned for the next installment in the Weapons Series.

Kode9's book is about this. Sound, Affect, and the Ecology of Fear. Haven't read it. Waiting for it to hit the NYPL.

[nowaysj]

Really compressing/limiting a sub can impart a lot of tension into the sound-- you won't really hear it, but you'll feel it at 105db in a club.

Sharmaji, I've really got no experience with making music for a club system. Wish I did. But can you talk more about this. This sub stuff seems like black magic.

When I creat my pure subs, I just use a sine from a synth, and control the dynamics in the synth. I don't have any peaks or any variation in the db.

What would compressing/limiting do to this in terms of creating tension?

And Macc - you spoke about receiving amateurish tracks for mastering that had a clinical sub just hanging off of the bottom end. Can you talk a little more about this relative to what Sharmaji is talking about?

PRETTY PLEASE! This stuff would be very very helpful for us newbs.

[antipode]

Hangover tips? In MY bass thread? It's more likely than you think.

OP, seriously, what's the key of the tune? I find anything below D# often has trouble replicating on a good system. E1 is just above 41hz; you're gonna need an expertly-built system along with well-placed speakers in a nicely tuned club room to replicate much below that. adding some harmonics via distortion or wave selection can help, as can layering something an octave up.

D#1 and C#1. (talking about 3osc here.)

I was thinking about layering some higher notes aswell (think coki does this on officer). Like to stick with sines, filtered other waves don't sound all that great to me when you get that low.

I distrust "sweet spots" to be honest, I think if anyone ever finds a sweet spot for bass, it's probably just the room harmonics. No note is inherently phatter than any other is it?


Shit heres the tune in question with an unmolested master channel.
http://www.zshare.net/audio/76450640b91898a0/
time to save up for monitors i think

Breakage Q&A please!