Vinyl Vs. Digital

[Majin]

There are alot of semantics to this. Most of them revolve around the fact this is Electronic music, and therefore everything is aliased regardless of if its cut or digital.

Therefore Im not gonna explain this from an electronic musicians point of view, Im gonna explain it from my view as a drummer!

Okay, say I record myself playing a little session, through a mic, out to tape. This is going to be un-aliased, and a preservation of the actual sound waves (sure, hardware colors, but)... Now, I send this tape through a converter and out to my PC, and send the reel itsself straight to an m.e. to be cut. In theory, the one which hasnt been put to a computer will be a higher quality.

Aliasing means its technically impossible to draw a true curve digitally. You have to draw 9 bajillion little straight lines that all intersect at very slight angles and come together to make a curve... ever play linerider?

But the thing is, with EDM, that going to happen REGARDLESS, soooo... semantics insue.

Bear this in mind though, when digital is cut to vinyl, they use 16bit waves, and when DJs play digital out, they use 320k mp3s... I dont think anyone will debate semantics about wav vs. mp3, thats hard to argue.

Sorry if my thoughts seem jumbled together or half formed here, I just woke up.

This ^. The difference between wav and vinyl (present or not) will be negligible, and mp3s are far lower quality than both vinyl and wav. Also, forgive me if I'm mistaken but my understanding is this: When an artist mixes down a track, they export a wav. That wav then gets mastered. The mastered wav then gets cut to vinyl, correct? So in that sense, in an ideal situation, the mastered wav and the cut vinyl will be identical. Any warmth added by the process of cutting to vinyl is just the result of the cut, not something placed there by the artist.

[Mad_EP]

i'm prefer not to wade into this peat-bog of a topic....


but i will say this: as a listener, i prefer sitting down and listening to a nice, thick slab of wax.

but as a digi dj- i prefer having a digi copy so i don't have to rip the shit.


sometimes it is that simple.

[abZ]

I am not really going to get into it either but I was putting on some of my older dubstep records last night and I have to be honest they sounded like crap! It's all the crackle and shit. I have actually gotten a little spoiled my digital because I didn't notice it as much when I was still all vinyl. I prefer a wav when it comes to dance music tbh. Now music that was recorded and mastered in the analog realm, as in old music, vinyl for sure.

[Ldizzy]

did a little research

this looks pretty legit:
http://www.amazon.com/Numark-TTX-USB-Tu ... 063&sr=1-1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KdSllzAS ... re=related

any other suggestion?

to me serato is def the closest to true dj experience...

[abZ]

did a little research

this looks pretty legit:
http://www.amazon.com/Numark-TTX-USB-Tu ... 063&sr=1-1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KdSllzAS ... re=related

any other suggestion?

to me serato is def the closest to true dj experience...

I laugh at the "true dj experience" wtf is that anyway. If you are selecting tunes and you have an audience then you are a dj. That's not even saying shit about beat matching. If anything true Djing is being a voice on radio, that is what the term was coined for.

[Ldizzy]

did a little research

this looks pretty legit:
http://www.amazon.com/Numark-TTX-USB-Tu ... 063&sr=1-1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KdSllzAS ... re=related

any other suggestion?

to me serato is def the closest to true dj experience...

I laugh at the "true dj experience" wtf is that anyway. If you are selecting tunes and you have an audience then you are a dj. That's not even saying shit about beat matching. If anything true Djing is being a voice on radio, that is what the term was coined for.

shouldve said traditional vinyl experience... sorry thats the turntablist in me.. i always imply a little scratching when i say dj...

i was wrong... def... a dj could dj with basically anything

reminded me of dj tape, the ussr dj

[the_agonist]

My friend loved sensi dub (mp3) and had been playing it for a long time...

i played him the white label of the same tune...with him having been subject to the mp3 for so long his ability to hear the difference and the reaction from him was staggering. His conclusion was that it was infinitely nicer to listen to. as a vinyl twat myself, i can't be bothered anymore with the online debates about it, the majority of people i have ever argued with over the difference are normally those who have not spent all of their free time and almost all the money they have ever earnt, on the black stuff. in all of this, no one has ever said mp3's are better (of course they aren't) but i've never met anybody with that opinion, other than the argument that mp3's are better for the fact that they are "less hassle", nobody has ever slated the sound of vinyl (other than a bad cut)

The difference is never gonna hit you in the face, and you won't miss what you can't hear or have never heard, but like my friend experienced, once you do know what has been missing you may feel like something is lacking next time round with your mp3's. The difference's can be some microfine audiophile picky bullshit, but it's like most things with audio...the common listener never hear's the difference, much in the same way that my girlfriend could not tell the difference between the audio going out of my soundcard into my monitors than out of my soundcard into my analogue compressor and pre-amp's then monitors...it did nothing for her, but for me and my friends who are into our gear, it made a world of difference for us.

[Andrumeda]

I could never really tell the difference

[Assassin]

To be honest the actual relationship of vinyl to digital in terms of original reproduction is firmly in favour of digital. Digital can give an almost exact replica aside from aliasing whereas a vinyl will always roll off the highs and boost slightly at the bass end cutting off some sub. But this sounds good.

Quote from http://www.djforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=255645

I feel like even posting this topic is tantamount to inciting a riot...

This is more or less an argument about why some DJs should not use vinyl...
*dons flame retardant helmet
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Vinyl has been and seems to be maintaining itself as the supposed gold standard in our industry... yet I want to question whether it truly lives up to the hype that it is given.

I've seen vinyl most often touted for its sound quality. This though confuses the hell out of me. First it is true that vinyl made from an original recording is the closest that we can produce to the original analog sound wave... except for the several stages in between the actual analog sound and its electronically amplified result.

Additionally vinyl misses certain low frequencies because you cant make a cut of that size in the record. High frequencies will also be cut out due to the materials physical limitations.

Also the "warmth" people hear in vinyl recordings is usually the static sound, a hissing that is produced when the record is played. The actual warmth I believe they mean is the signal breakup which makes the music sound more natural.
_________________
CDs are digital reproductions of analog waves, and no matter how much data you use you can not re-create a curve with steps. Additionally most CDs and mp3s are compressed files, where "unnecessary" sound is left out to make the file size smaller. CDs and mp3s, though some sound is already lost, often produce sound better than vinyl over a sound system.
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There are also multiple issues with sound reproduction, with vinyl, this is all dependent on how good your needle is, your connection, your crossover amp, and speakers.

If you do not have a great sound system, trying to DJ with vinyl can probably sound a lot worse that CDs.

The fact is that most of the time, the average listener (which in my opinion comprises the majority of audience members at clubs and parties) will not be able to tell whether you're playing music with good sound quality or not. Hell, there are probably DJs who can't either.
_________________
This post is mostly aimed to be informative. It is also a plug for .flac which I think is the greatest thing since sliced bread and the toaster oven.

I suppose if you want to take a message, especially for beginners, maybe "don't go out and buy TTs and vinyl just because people on the forums say that's what DJ's use." Records by far look the coolest when you're DJing, and are the standard for scratching. But just know what you're getting into when you use them.

To all those who will pull out single sentences of this post and crucify me for them; go .flac yourselves
-Afro

*P.S. crossover is in boldface because I believe its the piece of equipment that is most often forgotten about by starting DJs, thus resulting in bad blending of mid and bass tones and probably a lot of screwed up speakers

It's the fact vinyl isn't perfect that makes it sound special and in my opinion better, I grew up with vinyl and it's what I'm relearning to use as a dj.

[phrex]

it's less of a quality question (that is being discussed since the day one).

for me it's a question of mentality.

buying vinyl makes you more aware of the label, producer, mechanisms etc.

[deadly_habit]

meh i've spent 10s of thousands on vinyl over the years and only snag something on wax anymore if it's a real standout release
when it comes to quality a well mastered tune be it digital (we're talking wav or flac) or vinyl should sound about the same
with vinyl there's just too many variables that come into play for those people saying it just sounds better like condition of your styluses, what freqs your carts boost/cut, condition of your wax, how much dirt and dust get in your grooves, how much sweat, if the decks are maintained etc
plus it always sucks when you have to pay 10+ $ when you want just 1 side of 10 or 12"
the novelty has worn off for me when it comes to dance music
sampling or old funk etc wax all day

[-[2]DAY_-]

http://www.npr.org/blogs/therecord/2011 ... l-survives

[deadly_habit]

unfortunately it doesn't really hold true for dance music as much, at least the smaller labels as when a distro disappears (z-audio for example) who were footing the bills for pressing setup etc you lose a lot of labels
now if more labels took things into their own hands funds wise and used distros just as a warehouse to store the plates and what the name implies distributing to stores then maybe the industry would be in a bit better of shape
most of these articles regarding vinyl relate more to say indie 7" and labels with funding behind them not depending on p&d deals, and as much as i hate to say it that hipster retro chic is part of the driving force behind the resurgence

[-[2]DAY_-]

yup no doubt.... it was nice though that they give a nod to DJ culture and made mention of serato, thought it was kinda interesting.
I read online way too much

[nitzdaking]

bump

[TruthSayer22]

Digital FLAC or .WAV files would deffinetely be superior quality-wise than vinyl (in my opinion). The subtle-inconsistancy of speed on a vinyl due the manual play of the and the frequencies it can reproduce (or shall i say can't) woul deffinetely hinder it. Also it would depend on the needle and the turntable to dertimine the utmost quality, and seeing as music nowerdays is recorded/mixed using 24-16 bit digital audio technology it would only make sense that after mastered it would sound better in the form it was created in, if that makes sense.

however

I still think vinyl is personal choice amaongst purist dj's etc

[Depone]

The best way is to experience it..all my friends were asking me that question so I played Loefah's remix of Candyfloss on my computer 320 mp3 version,and then the same song through the same speakers but with my vinyl copy playing on my turntables and there's just no comparison for me..

Ah now, heres the thing, preparing tracks for vinyl uses a different type of mastering, as some specific technical issues will need to be addressed. Sometimes a diferent mastering engineer will do the digi version whilst one does the vinyl, so theres going to be a noticeable diference there.

I was chatting about this issue (Vinyl vs Digital) to a friend last night... And I just said, if you did a blind test, you probably wont hear the diference between digital (high res digital) and vinyl, because its almost subjective.
Some people prefer vinyl because its his or hers selected medium, and therefore is the best (for them), and therefore must sound the best, because they are used to 'its sound' and its almost nostalgic.

Honestly, try a blind test, sometimes the digital version trumps the vinyl and vice versa.

[deadly_habit]

i love how people compare 320 mp3s vs vinyl and not wav or flac vs vinyl
tools

[AxeD]

If the music is produced on a computer, pressing it does not enhance the quality. I use Traktor
and play 320's, don't even care about the difference between flac/wav and 320.

[safeandsound]

Yes completely different.

One thing about vinyl is the technical limitations are a determining factor in the sound.

Digital has more options in fact but most choose slammed.