[EDITED!] Music Theory for Dubsteppers [Production Bible v2]

[-[2]DAY_-]

I'm not following you here....

In F major the tritone is Bb and E natural. Yes, it's always the 4th and 7th scale degree in a major scale; similarly, always the 2nd and 6th in a natural minor scale. Tritones live in basically every classical scale, thats why i found the initial post erroneous.

[-[2]DAY_-]

also there's loads of harmonic minor melodies in western classical, dunno why you'd think not

[RmoniK]

also there's loads of harmonic minor melodies in western classical, dunno why you'd think not

I believe those would be called melodic melodies. They are used when you're melody is going up the scale only, if you're going down, you mostly use a aeolian minor. In melodic minor, you don't only raise the VII but also the VI. If you don't raise the VI, and you go up the scale, it gives a very indian/balkan feel. It's nice, but it's rarely used in western popmusic. Harmonic is mostly for chords, not for melodies. (at least, that's how i 've learned it and use it)

[-[2]DAY_-]

Harmonic & melodic are both used plenty in melody. yes, the classical rule for melodic was up only, down in aeolian.... thats a stupid rule that jazz players tossed aside, tho...

Harmonic is mostly for chords, not for melodies. (at least, that's how i 've learned it and use it)

modes are just modes... u can do with them what u like, or do without them if u like

there are innumerable melodies featuring harmonic minor

[inDistinkt]

First off I'm completely new to music theory and this thread is a huge help in aiding me through the basics of scales and chords.

I just have one simple question. When playing a certain scale, is it necessary for the first note you play to be the first note of the specific scale you're playing. For example if I want to play something in B Major, would the first note I play have to be B? Maybe this is a stupid question, but I have absolutely no knowledge in Music theory other than what I've read in this thread.

edit: Actually one other quick question. If I was playing something in say, C Major. If I played C3 then went down to something like D2, would that still pass as a C Major scale, or is it something more complicated?

[Ldizzy]

am i asking too much if i ask for soundfiles of actual chords and scales under each example.. something similar to what was made in this thread (sorry for the plug) :

/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=98178&start=40

[Duffman]

Music theory used to scare the shit out of me and I thought it was a lot more complicated then it actually is. A lot of the stuff mentioned in this thread I already knew from playing the guitar, I just couldn't explain it.

But yeah amazing thread, helped loads

[jrisreal]

Music Theory is important, kids

no but really, your music will sound like until you know your stuff

[jrosellie]

I have also been looking for something like this for ever. Thank you so much. I find it really easy to understand, it's straight to the point.
Now it's just a matter of remembering what notes are what and training my fingers.
I wish I had the time to practice this stuff, so I might just put a few stickers or something on my keyboard.
At least I can always just throw the notes into a matrix in reason and randomize it.

..
yeah dude,
i'm dealing with garageband and no midi or actual keyboard so
i'm just tearing up masking tape and sticking it on the letters and writing down certain combinations
let me know if you think of any other *cheats

[-[2]DAY_-]

i think drawing in piano roll notes is a great way to learn
Listen to the playback, and study they note groupings... shift some stuff around. You'll definitely get some kind of feel for the gaps between keys making certain sounds (intervals).

You'll definitely realize that moving notes up or down one space is a half-step (semitone) and moving them up or down two spaces is a whole step (aka whole tone). Get hip to the sound of that, then sequence some notes in whole and half steps, possibly while studying scales and modes if you like.

Learning how to change the feel of a chord by using a different root in the bass... also good approach

[rachtiiibam]

Arpeggios:

Arpeggios are much easier to understand than they sound! They are quite simply the first, third and fifth note of the scale played as individual notes. For example the arpeggio of C minor would be C Eb G C etc.

Thanks for a great guide Klimaxx! I've read it a couple of times now.

I do however disagree with what you've written about arpeggios.
A arpeggio is any broken chord in a scale. ie the notes of any chord played separately and not the first, third and fifth note in a scale.

Also. Would'nt it be great to explain the relation between scales and chords. eg that the 2, 3 and 6 chord in a major scale are minor chords?

[-[2]DAY_-]

heh, yeah it would be great but who wants to write out all the diatonic triads of every mode? Not me. Had to do it many times in school already.
It seems like busywork at the time but it will cause you to remember them, and internalize them and you come out of it a better musician.

[RmoniK]

why would you do that? And really. Stop messing with the modes. Modes different than minor, major and some rare mixolydians are unusual, especially in dubstep. They are just a way for people to brag with your music knowledge. Major and minor scales have some "special" chords that go a little towards the different modes, but actually writing an entire song in them is just nonsense. No one does it and i don't blame 'em.

[monkfish]

I don't know if anyone has mentioned this, but
“Tone, Semi-Tone, Tone, Tone, Semi-Tone, Tone, Semi-Tone”

Isn't it Tone, Semi-Tone, Tone, Tone, Semi-Tone, Tone, Tone?

[-[2]DAY_-]

why would you do that? And really. Stop messing with the modes. Modes different than minor, major and some rare mixolydians are unusual, especially in dubstep. They are just a way for people to brag with your music knowledge. Major and minor scales have some "special" chords that go a little towards the different modes, but actually writing an entire song in them is just nonsense. No one does it and i don't blame 'em.

this is nonsense
listen to kaiori breathe
also plenty of tearout and moody gloomy stuff uses modes... whether or not the composer meant to. a lot of people enjoy analyzing those parts of music... even if it was made unintentionally, or intended to sound a different way. That's the cool part. one person's interpretation of a sequence of notes can be wildly different than another's. Good composers direct you toward a certain meaning by giving the notes context -- what notes happened before and after it, what notes are happening at the same time, which bass note is root. Changing the root can dramatically alter an otherwise identical harmony. anyway music's meant to be interpreted by the listener.

Just look up a diminished scale (very easy scale), play it back to yourself, and tell me it's not used in dubstep. Also no one cares what scales you think are ok for dubstep. There are no rules afaik. That's one man's argument for disregarding the modes, and the next man's rationale for worshiping them.

I'm just well sick of people calling "elitist" at folks who care about theory. Thats bullshit. I don't call people elitist for being better than me at stuff. There's no pressure to conform to or even to appreciate theory here. But to say other folks shouldn't use it because you don't understand it.... that's akin to calling people "hater" just cuz they don't like what u like.

Also, there aren't any "rare mixolydians". There's one mixolydian, and it isn't rare. It's used ALLLL over the place.


/brag

[RmoniK]

I've been called elitist probably way more than you have, so don't worry about that. I know what you mean, i was just saying, there may be some diversity in the usage of modes but it's still rare in the (popular) dubstep scene. This thread is meant as an introduction to music theory. When you're starting out, you don't use that kind of stuff. It's more confusing than something else. Keep it simple at first, go further when you know what you're doing/feel you've reached a point where you need to expand your knowledge to become better. And by rare myxolydian, i mean it's not used a lot. I know there's just one.

Also, completely out of context, i looove the artist you mentioned, kaiori breathe; got any more of that stuff?

[ceeeluvv]

This is a great post! One correction, though. In your discussion of minor scales you state that the formula to construct the minor scale is “Tone, Semi-Tone, Tone, Tone, Semi-Tone, Tone, Semi-Tone”. In constructing the C Minor scale, you go from A-flat to B which is more than one tone as the formula states. It should go from A-flat to B-flat.

[mks]

This is a great post! One correction, though. In your discussion of minor scales you state that the formula to construct the minor scale is “Tone, Semi-Tone, Tone, Tone, Semi-Tone, Tone, Semi-Tone”. In constructing the C Minor scale, you go from A-flat to B which is more than one tone as the formula states. It should go from A-flat to B-flat.

I believe that was sort of answered in this thread already. That is a harmonic minor which has a bit more of an Eastern sound to it with the major 7th. Probably not quite as common as a natural minor with the flat 7th which is the Aeolian mode.

[Nunz]

I understand basic music theory, but I'm unable to apply to a song. How do the random synths come in to play with the chords I am using? For example Mord and his riffs. I can make those chords, but not add a little melodic riff or nice effects on top.

[Sonika]

I understand basic music theory, but I'm unable to apply to a song. How do the random synths come in to play with the chords I am using? For example Mord and his riffs. I can make those chords, but not add a little melodic riff or nice effects on top.

Do you understand chord scales and how they fit into a key?