Bass Expertise Please!

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asusu
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Bass Expertise Please!

Post by asusu » Thu Jun 28, 2007 1:37 pm

Sup guys, need a lil bit of help with a track i'm doing. I've been trying to get the bass to sit properly in the mix. I want it to be that type of feel-it-in-ya-chest bass, but it doesn't sound like it at the mo, maybe it's just making the mix sound muddy?
The link is - www.virb.com/asusu
It's the top track entitled 'esoteric'. Still a work-in-progress, so any help would be much appreciated...

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konkanok
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Post by konkanok » Thu Jun 28, 2007 11:41 pm

You could try re-sampling your bass a number of times, might hav to bounce it down to audio first. Apart from that just limiting and EQ.. i guess. What kinda system are you playing it back on?

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asusu
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Post by asusu » Thu Jun 28, 2007 11:54 pm

well i'm only using one monitor (samson rubicon) at the moment cos the cones fucked on the other. not cheap to repair... they do say your sposed to mix in mono (or at least check your mix in mono) then do the panning though. i'm using a pair of beyer dt100's for the panning now.
what did you mean by resampling the bass? bouncing it down and then loading it back into the project? how would i be able to get a better mix by doing this?

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untold
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Post by untold » Fri Jun 29, 2007 11:06 am

the bass is really quiet compared to the kicks. turning it up a few db's will help.

can't really tell from the clip, but if the bass patch is lacking sub frequencies then use another source to play the sub notes (just use a sine wave) and take the existing bass, eq out the lower freq's and layer on top.

use a spectrum analyser to check where the dominant frequencies of the kick drum are, eq out some of these frequencies from the bass to stop it clashing with the kick. Sidechaining the bass to the kick can help as well

check production bible ^^ for more info

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Post by pushre » Fri Jun 29, 2007 12:24 pm

untold wrote:use another source to play the sub notes (just use a sine wave) and take the existing bass, eq out the lower freq's and layer on top.

use a spectrum analyser to check where the dominant frequencies of the kick drum are, eq out some of these frequencies from the bass to stop it clashing with the kick
That is the key for sure.

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asusu
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Post by asusu » Fri Jun 29, 2007 3:04 pm

cheers for the help guys, really useful advice :)

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Post by thenapking » Fri Jun 29, 2007 7:08 pm

can't listen to this at the mo, but sidechaining is always good for the bass to make sure you can have it as loud as possible but the kicks will still punch through.
see if you can get hold of the kjaerhus compressors. they are great for this.

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Post by dubsteppa » Mon Jul 02, 2007 9:44 am

your tracks are very minimal so id avoid trying to put any grimmy wobble in just have a nice eqd vst such as the orca or somin
(iv been producing using 1 hifi speaker l8ly it sucks trust :)

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Post by the_pearl » Sat Jul 07, 2007 1:17 am

asusu wrote:well i'm only using one monitor (samson rubicon) at the moment cos the cones fucked on the other. not cheap to repair... they do say your sposed to mix in mono (or at least check your mix in mono) then do the panning though. i'm using a pair of beyer dt100's for the panning now.
what did you mean by resampling the bass? bouncing it down and then loading it back into the project? how would i be able to get a better mix by doing this?
There's not much advantage to mono, in any context. The sidechain advice was good though. Also just playaround with band-pass EQing. Make sure any other sounds have anything lower than 75-85 Hz filtered out. Find a "notch" for your bass to ride in. Meaning..carve out some space in the frequency spectrum for your bass to sit in by removing those frequencies in other sounds. Most "mud" is in the low-mids...about 400-800 Hz. Can be as low as 250 Hz though. Read Future Producers for good mixing tips, and get a book called "Mastering Audio" by Bob Katz (damn I just gave away my secret weapon)...if you learn that stuff, there's nothing you can't do in the mix. Safe.

phishu
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mono

Post by phishu » Sun Jul 08, 2007 7:07 pm

actually, in the context of balancing a mix, mono is extremely useful, not least to check for phase cancellation. It's a rule of thumb that if a mix does not work in mono it most likely will suffer problems in stereo. Checking the balance of a mix in mono is still standard practice for commercial projects.

Also, in terms of mixing for cutting to vinyl, some mastering places advise that to achieve optimum results, it is mandatory for all signals below 500Hz to be in mono - owing to the limitation of certain stereo cutting heads - obviously there are no such limitations when mastering to a digital format. Note that in a lot of clubs you are not actually getting a true impression of a stereo mix so most of the time it may just as well be in mono. More on mono below.



SOS Forum Post

Question: I read recently that when top engineers check their mixes in mono, they don't just hit a mono switch, but instead route the mix through a single speaker to hear it in true mono. What's the difference between the two?

Technical Editor Hugh Robjohns replies: It's important to check the derived mono signal from a stereo mix to ensure that nothing unexpected or unacceptable will be heard by anyone listening in mono, as could be the case in poor FM radio reception areas, on portable radios, in clubs, on the Internet and so on. Mono compatibility, as it's called, is very important for commercial releases — the artist, producer and record company want the record to sound as good as possible in these less-than-ideal circumstances.

In addition to simply checking the finished product, mixing in mono, or regularly switching the monitoring to mono while mixing, is very useful and a good habit to get into. Summing to mono removes any misleading phasing between the left and right signals that can make a stereo mix sound artificially 'big'.

The crucial difference between auditioning the summed mono signal on a single speaker, as compared to a 'phantom' mono image between two speakers, relates to the perceived balance of the bass end of the frequency spectrum. When you listen to a mono signal on two speakers, you hear a false or 'phantom' image which seems to float midway between the speakers, but because both speakers are contributing to the sound, the impression is of a slightly over-inflated level of bass. Listening to mono via one speaker — the way everyone else will hear it — reveals the material in its true form!

Checking the derived mono is always best done in the monitoring section of the mixer or with a dedicated monitor controller. Although a mono signal can be derived in the output sections of a mixer (real or virtual), this is potentially dangerous — if you should forget to cancel the mono mixing, you'll end up with a very mono final mix. It does happen, believe me! Sadly, very few monitor controllers outside of broadcast desks and related equipment provide facilities to check mono on a single speaker. Most provide a phantom mono image, which is fine for checking imaging accuracy and phasing issues, but no good for checking the mono balance.

http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/nov05/a ... 1106_4.htm

P.S. the Bob Katz book is a must buy, but you can find a lot of articles from it on his site http://www.digido.com/articles/index.php

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asusu
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Post by asusu » Sun Jul 08, 2007 10:50 pm

sound on sound is the holy grail :) I heard that one drum and bass artist (forgot who) only mixes in mono because that's how it's gonna sound in clubs...

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Post by j_j » Tue Jul 10, 2007 10:25 am

i did the bass in 'Spliff dub' with the frequency wobble from your belly to your chest via dynamics, compresion, vintage warmers and some bad boy ears.

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Post by rhjames » Tue Jul 10, 2007 12:17 pm

J_J wrote:i did the bass in 'Spliff dub' with the frequency wobble from your belly to your chest via dynamics, compresion, vintage warmers and some bad boy ears.
You're my hero

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Post by j_j » Fri Jul 13, 2007 11:41 am

your a neek... 8)

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Post by rekordah » Tue Aug 21, 2007 12:00 pm

J_J wrote:i did the bass in 'Spliff dub' with the frequency wobble from your belly to your chest via dynamics, compresion, vintage warmers and some bad boy ears.
:roll:
19th October - Jahtari Presents Tapes EP Launch Party @ Gramaphone, London w/ Tapes, Clause Four & International Observer.
23rd October - Galway, Ireland.
31st October - UFO @ Dojo, Bristol w/ Dema.

http://www.myspace.com/rekorder87

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