Mixing snare with rest of track

[Sliverdub]

Hi guys I've read all the main threads on mixing but this specific question was answered, maybe my lack of experience maybe it was worded somewhat different. Basically I am finding that when I make one of them snares that are boosted around 200hz it sounds great, still sounds great when the drums are playing too but by the time I add wobbles and other stuff it vanishes and all I can hear is a bit of the tail despite the fact that I can see it peaking on my output of ableton. This is something to do with the frequency content of the other stuff yeah?, but when I EQ the other stuff to fit the snare it spoils the sound. How do you guys deal with this or am I barking up the wrong tree? Many thanks in advance.

[mthrfnk]

Sidechain your synths to the snare, but not as heavily as you would a kick.

[DIGIPLAST]

Yeah it's either an eq problem or you need more compression on the snares or drums.

[NinjaEdit]

Have you tried cutting your synths at 200Hz?

[Sliverdub]

Thanks for the replays guys, I will try ducking, am watching a tut on this atm also what will adding more compression to my drums actually do for this issue. I'm not asking a rhetorical question I'm a proper noob. I know what compression does but don't understand how it will help in this case because it's just the snare vanishes. Could I use a combination of all you answers very subtly so each little trick is less noticeable ? Also sorry for all the dumb ass questions but when you say cut, cut by how much and in what way?

[mthrfnk]

Thanks for the replays guys, I will try ducking, am watching a tut on this atm also what will adding more compression to my drums actually do for this issue. I'm not asking a rhetorical question I'm a proper noob. I know what compression does but don't understand how it will help in this case because it's just the snare vanishes. Could I use a combination of all you answers very subtly so each little trick is less noticeable ? Also sorry for all the dumb ass questions but when you say cut, cut by how much and in what way?

If I were trying to fix your problem, I'd first route all my drums to a single mixer channel on which I'd have some combination of a saturator, transient shaper & compressor. I'd then notch out 200hz region on your synths using an EQ, with quite a small bandwidth. Then I'd set up the sidechain to the synths. I'd then route the drums and synths to another mixer channel where I would again apply a compressor to glue to two before finally routing this channel to the master.

[NinjaEdit]

I think when he says it's a compression problem, he means it's been over compressed, if you have.

A transient shaper may be another solution, adding some attack, or transient, to the sound.

I mean using an EQ to cut the Synth at 200Hz, which may have been the frequency which makes the snare stand out. I think 90% of the time it's more useful to EQ and otherwise affect your sounds in context, partly to avoid this problem of things clashing. It may be a matter of EQing your snare and synth again now that you can hear them together.

[Sliverdub]

Ok so it looks like routing it right and trying a combination of things maybe the way to. I tried equing out a small bit of the synth but it think makes the snare thin but have saved that as a different project to check tommorow cos maybe just because it sounds different doesn't mean it sounds bad? I've noticed this a lot since I've started this, what I mean is if you change something mostly when EQing then it can seem to sound odd but I guess if the context is right then it works but stuff doesn't just jump out at you as being right like you would imagine it would.

[NinjaEdit]

Maybe things are out of tune? Try pitch shifting the snare.

[ehbes]

Side chain an eq to the synth so whenever the snare hits the eq cut is triggered

[Sliverdub]

Ok I've tried most things that have been suggested so far with exception of sudechaining the EQ I cannot find how to do this in ableton, I have only stock plugins and Massive. For the most part all these ways have helped, it's taken me all afternoon lol but a little bit here and there seemed to have gone a long way but the weird thing is that the best thing I've done for my snare is changed the kick, I don't know how this works but the sound I'm getting from the snare is now the sound you would expect to be after the new kick. It's like they go together better. I only changed the kick cos I messed up the sound of my first kick but for dome reason the snare sounds less alien to the track. Your tips have helped loads. Big thanks

[lucozade]

ey wat about lik multiband sid chain?

[baddaBOOM]

Make shure the eq levels are good, compress it and level out the audio levels on the mixer, sidechain whatever it takes, really recommend you to get a mastering book it teaches you everything you need to know, make shure your making your snares in a way it sounds as loud as the kick by itself. Layering your snare, and adding diffrent types of distortion but not too much because if you over do it , it will sound bad. WOW filter is really got for this kind of stuff if you need to bring levels up. make shure nothing is peaking etc etc, cheers

[Jizz]

ey wat about lik multiband sid chain?

side chain your keyboard as well

[Sliverdub]

Sidechain my keyboard?

[itzDetrimental]

Ok I've tried most things that have been suggested so far with exception of sudechaining the EQ I cannot find how to do this in ableton, I have only stock plugins and Massive. For the most part all these ways have helped, it's taken me all afternoon lol but a little bit here and there seemed to have gone a long way but the weird thing is that the best thing I've done for my snare is changed the kick, I don't know how this works but the sound I'm getting from the snare is now the sound you would expect to be after the new kick. It's like they go together better. I only changed the kick cos I messed up the sound of my first kick but for dome reason the snare sounds less alien to the track. Your tips have helped loads. Big thanks

Drop a compressor on your synth channel in Ableton. Click on the little arrow in the top left of the compressor, right next to the power button. Turn on the option 'sidechain' and then select your input. Since your snares are the thing you want to sidechain to, set the input to your Snares channel.

Here's a screenie of what it should look similar to:


edit: grammar / more details.

[Samuel_L_Damnson]

I honestly think your best result will come from a decent eq job without sidechaining (unless you want the sort of pumping effect). I sort of see it as a less natural sound. Just eq the snare and the bass relative to each other (remove prominent frequency stuff in the snare from the bass and and what not)

[NinjaEdit]

Ok I've tried most things that have been suggested so far with exception of sudechaining the EQ I cannot find how to do this in ableton, I have only stock plugins and Massive. For the most part all these ways have helped, it's taken me all afternoon lol but a little bit here and there seemed to have gone a long way but the weird thing is that the best thing I've done for my snare is changed the kick, I don't know how this works but the sound I'm getting from the snare is now the sound you would expect to be after the new kick. It's like they go together better. I only changed the kick cos I messed up the sound of my first kick but for dome reason the snare sounds less alien to the track. Your tips have helped loads. Big thanks

Drop a compressor on your synth channel in Ableton. Click on the little arrow in the top left of the compressor, right next to the power button. Turn on the option 'sidechain' and then select your input. Since your snares are the thing you want to sidechain to, set the input to your Snares channel.

Here's a screenie of what it should look similar to:


edit: grammar / more details.

He was after sidechain EQ.

make shure nothing is peaking

Yeah, I thought of this recently as well. Maybe as you boost the snare with EQ, you're running the output into the red and it's clipping. Turn down the output volume from the EQ to compensate.

Check the MONEYSHOT THREAD for more tips on gain structure (like don't touch the faders, especially the master fader).

[itzDetrimental]

Ok I've tried most things that have been suggested so far with exception of sudechaining the EQ I cannot find how to do this in ableton, I have only stock plugins and Massive. For the most part all these ways have helped, it's taken me all afternoon lol but a little bit here and there seemed to have gone a long way but the weird thing is that the best thing I've done for my snare is changed the kick, I don't know how this works but the sound I'm getting from the snare is now the sound you would expect to be after the new kick. It's like they go together better. I only changed the kick cos I messed up the sound of my first kick but for dome reason the snare sounds less alien to the track. Your tips have helped loads. Big thanks

Drop a compressor on your synth channel in Ableton. Click on the little arrow in the top left of the compressor, right next to the power button. Turn on the option 'sidechain' and then select your input. Since your snares are the thing you want to sidechain to, set the input to your Snares channel.

Here's a screenie of what it should look similar to:


edit: grammar / more details.

He was after sidechain EQ.

make shure nothing is peaking

Yeah, I thought of this recently as well. Maybe as you boost the snare with EQ, you're running the output into the red and it's clipping. Turn down the output volume from the EQ to compensate.

Check the MONEYSHOT THREAD for more tips on gain structure (like don't touch the faders, especially the master fader).

For some reason the EQ part didn't register when I read it.

[wub]

Side chain an eq to the synth so whenever the snare hits the eq cut is triggered

Exactly what I was going to say