British Empire

Dystinkt · Post by **Dystinkt** » Wed Oct 08, 2014 5:24 pm

I was having a debate with the old man over dinner earlier on, and I came to the conclusion that The Biritsh Empire was potentially the worst thing to happen to the modern world (gold star for anyone that can find another 19 year old that enjoys discussing historical and philosophical debates as opposed to taking selfies). The way we divided up our empire when we realised colonialism was pretty silly has either directly or indirectly resulted in virtually every conflict and war over the past 100-200 years. thoughts anyone?

ehbes · Post by **ehbes** » Wed Oct 08, 2014 6:02 pm

Dystinkt wrote:I was having a debate with the old man over dinner earlier on, and I came to the conclusion that The Biritsh Empire was potentially the worst thing to happen to the modern world (gold star for anyone that can find another 19 year old that enjoys discussing historical and philosophical debates as opposed to taking selfies). The way we divided up our empire when we realised colonialism was pretty silly has either directly or indirectly resulted in virtually every conflict and war over the past 100-200 years. thoughts anyone?

i'd say Western (American) foreign policy post WW1 has fucked this place up pretty good as well.

also, i'd like my gold star

Forum · Post by **Forum** » Wed Oct 08, 2014 6:13 pm

Dystinkt wrote:I was having a debate with the old man over dinner earlier on, and I came to the conclusion that The Biritsh Empire was potentially the worst thing to happen to the modern world (gold star for anyone that can find another 19 year old that enjoys discussing historical and philosophical debates as opposed to taking selfies). The way we divided up our empire when we realised colonialism was pretty silly has either directly or indirectly resulted in virtually every conflict and war over the past 100-200 years. thoughts anyone?

I think you're forgetting a certain central European country

ezza · Post by **ezza** » Wed Oct 08, 2014 6:18 pm

what does british empire even mean? like the kings n shit? that was ages ago cant see how it would of fucked things up too bad. fuck that guy who cut baaare of his wifes heads of tho, mediaval shit was dark lol

Forum · Post by **Forum** » Wed Oct 08, 2014 6:19 pm

ezza wrote:what does british empire even mean? like the kings n shit? that was ages ago cant see how it would of fucked things up too bad. fuck that guy who cut baaare of his wifes heads of tho, mediaval shit was dark lol

gr8 b8

magma · Post by **magma** » Wed Oct 08, 2014 6:21 pm

I think you can probably argue it was the worst and the best in almost equal measure. It's difficult not to sound like the stereotypical patronising European to argue it was good, but for all its failings, it arguably did more to unite the world and lay the foundations for the "globalisation" which American quasi-imperialism built on in the 20th Century than anything else. We wouldn't have had the World Wars without all the vying empires, but we probably wouldn't have things like the UN and the WHO and we wouldn't have 'learnt our lessons' as a species about the dangers of naked Imperialism... hell, we probably wouldn't even be talking about this on the Internet. If we hadn't gone through the enormous global trade boom of the Industrial Revolution (yes, globalised down the barrel of a rifle) we may not have ever built the institutions that will stop it happening again.

But yeah, I think all Imperial ages tend to be run so much in the self-interest of the Mother country that the spread of enlightenment and 'order' is always incredibly unfair. I don't think India would be the burgeoning economy it is today if it hadn't been on the journey it has, but I'm not sure you can ever truly justify the horrors that occurred there... horrors we and they are still feeling the effects of today. Worse, the British Empire helped create and enforce the institutionalised slavery of black people and it's difficult to even turn on the radio without being reminded of that at some point. It also got a fuckload of Chinese people addicted to opium and the rest of us addicted to sugar.

I don't see the British Empire as an isolated event really... I think if we went back to a non-industrialised world and forgot all the advances from the 1700s onwards, the first country to work it all out whilst sitting on an island full of coal would create an Empire in order to spread that knowledge and power. It's happened at all points of human civilisation when a power gap has appeared... the difference with the British Empire is that when it ended, wider civilisation didn't follow suit. When the Roman Empire went down it took European civilisation centuries to get properly back on track... Britain was plunged into the Dark Ages and an awful lot of knowledge was lost. Arguably, the British Empire's greatest victory was that it was so effective at spreading knowledge of the sciences and (maybe more importantly) philosophy/politics that it practically brought about its own end... the Romans would've never been stupid enough to export John Stuart Mill to their colonies!

When the British first went to India, the plan was always for it to be independent eventually. Even as far along as McCaulay and the British Raj, the overriding aim (along with "casshhhhh") was to take a vast, populous country that struggled to organise itself and turn it into a modern industrial utopia that had favourable business ties to Britain. That idea sort of got lost along the way and they eventually had to seize independence for themselves, but the end result, 300 years later, isn't really that far off. The same can't always be said of India's neighbours where the Empire didn't get involved...

I've never truly made my mind up about Empire. I'm glad we appear to be over that now because I've only got the stomach for it in history books. Imagine if the French had taken America instead though? Just IMAGINE.

As for the "worst" thing to happen... the Holocaust stands out for me. 6 million dead on racist grounds in a matter of a few years.

tl;dr I don't know.

nobody · Post by **nobody** » Wed Oct 08, 2014 6:24 pm

Dystinkt wrote: The way we divided up our empire when we realised colonialism was pretty silly

Yep that's what happened

ehbes · Post by **ehbes** » Wed Oct 08, 2014 6:25 pm

nobody wrote:
Dystinkt wrote: The way we divided up our empire when we realised colonialism was pretty silly
Yep that's what happened

we even got a severance package

wolf89 · Post by **wolf89** » Wed Oct 08, 2014 6:33 pm

Dystinkt wrote: (gold star for anyone that can find another 19 year old that enjoys discussing historical and philosophical debates as opposed to taking selfies).

Yeah I can't be arsed with discussing something with someone who thinks this is worth mentioning like it makes them a genius

Harkat · Post by **Harkat** » Wed Oct 08, 2014 6:43 pm

Dystinkt wrote:(gold star for anyone that can find another 19 year old that enjoys discussing historical and philosophical debates as opposed to taking selfies)

Muncey · Post by **Muncey** » Wed Oct 08, 2014 6:48 pm

wolf89 wrote:
Dystinkt wrote: (gold star for anyone that can find another 19 year old that enjoys discussing historical and philosophical debates as opposed to taking selfies).
Yeah I can't be arsed with discussing something with someone who thinks this is worth mentioning like it makes them a genius

nobody · Post by **nobody** » Wed Oct 08, 2014 6:59 pm

OP is a pretty cool dude

Dystinkt · Post by **Dystinkt** » Wed Oct 08, 2014 7:04 pm

Muncey wrote:
wolf89 wrote:
Dystinkt wrote: (gold star for anyone that can find another 19 year old that enjoys discussing historical and philosophical debates as opposed to taking selfies).
Yeah I can't be arsed with discussing something with someone who thinks this is worth mentioning like it makes them a genius

why do you take yourself so seriously? I made this thread because nobody I know around my age has any interest in this sort of thing, yet if I wanted to talk about the X Fucktor or Strictly tnuc dancing I'd have people queing outside my house (and I imagine you guys would slate me just as much if I tried to discuss something like that). I'm sorry if you guys thought I was being arrogant I really didn't intend to come across that way, but I think you're ultimately just a bit miserable.

Dystinkt · Post by **Dystinkt** » Wed Oct 08, 2014 7:05 pm

Muncey wrote:
wolf89 wrote:
Dystinkt wrote: (gold star for anyone that can find another 19 year old that enjoys discussing historical and philosophical debates as opposed to taking selfies).
Yeah I can't be arsed with discussing something with someone who thinks this is worth mentioning like it makes them a genius

why do you take yourself so seriously? I made this thread because nobody I know around my age has any interest in this sort of thing, yet if I wanted to talk about the X Fucktor or Strictly tnuc dancing I'd have people queing outside my house (and I imagine you guys would slate me just as much if I tried to discuss something like that). I'm sorry if you guys thought I was being arrogant I really didn't intend to come across that way, but I think you're ultimately just a bit miserable.

nobody · Post by **nobody** » Wed Oct 08, 2014 7:05 pm

post a selfie

Harkat · Post by **Harkat** » Wed Oct 08, 2014 7:08 pm

yeah i bet your selfie game is lacking

Jizz · Post by **Jizz** » Wed Oct 08, 2014 7:09 pm

Dystinkt wrote:(gold star for anyone that can find another 19 year old that enjoys discussing historical and philosophical debates as opposed to taking selfies)

come on now, this is just a descriptive selfie

nobody · Post by **nobody** » Wed Oct 08, 2014 7:09 pm

I have a feeling he's a ginger

Muncey · Post by **Muncey** » Wed Oct 08, 2014 7:09 pm

Dystinkt wrote:I'm sorry if you guys thought I was being arrogant I really didn't intend to come across that way

Gold star for guessing which bit made you sound like an arrogant twat!

But ultimately I think you need new friends.

sixs · Post by **sixs** » Wed Oct 08, 2014 7:12 pm

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