The death of Vinyl

[nicon]

if labels just put out their records when their hot instead of battering them out over and over and over and over again till your sick of them..

for instance.. eastern jam came out on the perfect moment.. it was hype.. not battered too much yet and the request for this record was immence.. this is the way to sell the most records...

and dubstep is one of the strongest selling vinyl genres of our time.. allmost on the same level as dnb these days

[jolly wailer]

I want to shoot myself in the face everytime I see this thread. Really genius to be able to perceive that a market is 'moving somewhere'.. or rather, that consumers have been effectively conditioned to accept a corporately orchestrated 'inevitability' of what they will have to begin consuming if they want to 'keep up'..


dubstepz do you work for beatport?

[dubstepz]

dubstepz do you work for beatport?

Head of Marketing

[jolly wailer]

hope u'r kidding

[biomat]

u guys must be seriously deaf when u say digital sounds better than vinyl
sure, theres some poor vinyl cuts but in example try listen to "poison dart" in wav on headphones, then play 45 EP
u must be DEAF i say

[casioboy]

Sticking to the "vinyl only" culture is like sticking to the "analog harware only" culture, it's cool to have a moog prodigy at home, but in the end you prefer tweaking your albino3 with your cheap mouse.

WAV'S are, less expensive, easier to carry, sound better than vinyl + dj'ing software kicks TTBS's ass any day of the week.


just my 2 cents.

[abs]

u guys must be seriously deaf when u say digital sounds better than vinyl
sure, theres some poor vinyl cuts but in example try listen to "poison dart" in wav on headphones, then play 45 EP
u must be DEAF i say

Are you sure?

Vinyl is a chunk of plastic being read by a little needle.

While a WAV is some mega super high quality thing being read by a laser inside a really good computer with 7 procesors and 8 gigs of ram.

u must be deaf m8 yea lol

[biomat]

u guys must be seriously deaf when u say digital sounds better than vinyl
sure, theres some poor vinyl cuts but in example try listen to "poison dart" in wav on headphones, then play 45 EP
u must be DEAF i say

Are you sure?

Vinyl is a chunk of plastic being read by a little needle.

While a WAV is some mega super high quality thing being read by a laser inside a really good computer with 7 procesors and 8 gigs of ram.

u must be deaf m8 yea lol

lol))))))) analog/digital ....digital/analog....nothing??

[kani]

might help for mp3 fans to do some homework here,

natural sound is closest to an analog signal, (hence the name, analogous) and can be a pure sine wave,
digital sound can only generate intervals that simulate that sine wave, a slide versus a ladder if you will, both will get you to a different level but one is a whole lot smoother.
granted most sounds now are reduced to the digital format at some point and how they are formatted after that is a semi moot point, but the basics still apply to amplification. a digital signal still uses intervals to come as close as possible to an analog signal.

a good read was some of the interviews regarding the last Amon Tobin album, where he used a Naga tape recorder to take foley style field recordings to use in his production, that way he could slow them down, speed them up without having aliasing issues.

[jolly wailer]

Sticking to the "vinyl only" culture is like sticking to the "analog harware only" culture, it's cool to have a moog prodigy at home, but in the end you prefer tweaking your albino3 with your cheap mouse.

WAV'S are, less expensive, easier to carry, sound better than vinyl + dj'ing software kicks TTBS's ass any day of the week.


just my 2 cents.

speak for yourself I'd rather have a moog.


@ Abs. ok, you seem to know what vinyl is and what a .wav is but you did absolutely nothing to explain why one would be better than the other.

bare sense being chatted these days.

[symbl]

But... like drum and bass... laptop dj's don't exist yet.

Sure about that?

[slothrop]

After deciding to pick up a bit of Funky from Uptown, I can kind of see why vinyl is at risk tbh - there's a lot of releases where you pay seven or eight quid plus P&P to get
A1 the track you actually wanted
A2 instrumental cut of the track you wanted
B1 rubbish by-numbers bassline mix of the track you wanted
B2 rubbish by-numbers electro mix of the track you wanted

So that's eight or nine quid to get one track. (I'm not some luddite remix hater here, by the way, really solid remixes are fine, I'm talking generic rerubs in styles that you don't really care about.)

I like buying vinyl because I like having a physical object to look at and to connect with the music, but if I was a DJ trying to put together a good, varied selection on a budget there is no way I'd be buying primarily vinyl when I could get eight or so mp3s for the same price.

Maybe part of the reason that vinyl still sells strongly in dubstep is that there's a lot less of that sort of thing than in some genres - if the vinyl comes with three or four tracks, you're probably going to get three or four tracks - either originals or remixes - that are actually worth having and that if you were a DJ you might actually play...

[abs]

@ Abs. ok, you seem to know what vinyl is and what a .wav is but you did absolutely nothing to explain why one would be better than the other.

bare sense being chatted these days.

I personally prefer not to use vinyl, if i could afford and get hold of everything i wanted i'd use vinyl, but i'm not paying hundreds of pounds just build up a collection of tunes that i'm gonna be bored of in a few weeks, and like someone said, i'm not paying for some shitty bassline remix that nobody cares about... and wavs and really well mastered 320s sound better anyway.

also, people chatting about how it sounds nicer on vinyl.. you think some turd tune dubstep producer X made on fruity loops is gonna sound better on vinyl? when it was made on a computer in the first place? it's not live music transfered from 8-tracks here is it, it's shitty throw away dance music most of the time, be honest with yourself, it's not like Skream was sitting in his flat messing around with loads of interesting analogue recording techniques when he made any of his tunes was he? it's just some cheap software on his mums laptop with a pair of sony headphones from tesco.

[de-fi]

I started off playing vinyl when learning to DJ, and have carried on buying vinyl since. I play a lot of reggae and dub as well as dubstep, and really just love the feel, smell and tactile sensations when spinning vinyl. There really is something special about having a crate dig as well.

I've also recently bought traktor as well with the vague hope that this would stop me spending fortunes on vinyl, but it hasn't. I can download a larger selection of music - and this is my primary way of sourcing music, but I do find there is a considerable amount of tosh released on digital - probably because it's a lot easier to do so. The tracks that I find I like the most I will try and hunt down on wax later. In fact it was on this last week or so that I invested in my first dubstep plates (have just used digital before now).

When I'm out at a club, I love being able to go and peer over the decks to try and see what a DJ is playing and I think that there is a lot more ownership and prestige involved with owning and playing vinyl. Which I think is a good thing. Before I started DJ'ing I used to use torrents loads, and would download huge amounts of music, without really knowing what it sounded like even, just to have it. With vinyl you can't really do this. I think for me anyway, having a record on vinyl helps me learn the song better as well, in so far as where the needle is placed, and just my memory of the physical piece of plastic.

I don't think that we should be deliberately moving more towards a digital preferrence, if it happens then ok, but it shouldn't be forced.

[hackman]

if labels just put out their records when their hot instead of battering them out over and over and over and over again till your sick of them..

for instance.. eastern jam came out on the perfect moment.. it was hype.. not battered too much yet and the request for this record was immence.. this is the way to sell the most records...

and dubstep is one of the strongest selling vinyl genres of our time.. allmost on the same level as dnb these days

this
and can't you claim records in your tax receipt if your making money as a dj?

[hackman]

@ Abs. ok, you seem to know what vinyl is and what a .wav is but you did absolutely nothing to explain why one would be better than the other.

bare sense being chatted these days.

I personally prefer not to use vinyl, if i could afford and get hold of everything i wanted i'd use vinyl, but i'm not paying hundreds of pounds just build up a collection of tunes that i'm gonna be bored of in a few weeks, and like someone said, i'm not paying for some shitty bassline remix that nobody cares about... and wavs and really well mastered 320s sound better anyway.

also, people chatting about how it sounds nicer on vinyl.. you think some turd tune dubstep producer X made on fruity loops is gonna sound better on vinyl? when it was made on a computer in the first place? it's not live music transfered from 8-tracks here is it, it's shitty throw away dance music most of the time, be honest with yourself, it's not like Skream was sitting in his flat messing around with loads of interesting analogue recording techniques when he made any of his tunes was he? it's just some cheap software on his mums laptop with a pair of sony headphones from tesco.

and you still havent explained why ones better than the other

[spencertron]

also, people chatting about how it sounds nicer on vinyl.. you think some turd tune dubstep producer X made on fruity loops is gonna sound better on vinyl? when it was made on a computer in the first place? it's not live music transfered from 8-tracks here is it, it's shitty throw away dance music most of the time, be honest with yourself, it's not like Skream was sitting in his flat messing around with loads of interesting analogue recording techniques when he made any of his tunes was he? it's just some cheap software on his mums laptop with a pair of sony headphones from tesco.

So music made on acoustic instruments and recorded on a reel to reel recorder is more worthy than a lone producer with a laptop set-up to make music from? i know loads of shit bands with shit demo's. The fact that software is cheap in comparison to full bands doesn't mean you can't compose a good tune, or produce music on par with pro studio's (and the warmth that comes with them).

Digital signal processing is so good these days (reaktor/Max/msp/Massive/numerous VST's) that i think you would be hard pushed to tell which audio is hardware and which is digital when produced well.

[struggle]

i'm not paying hundreds of pounds just build up a collection of tunes that i'm gonna be bored of in a few weeks..

when it comes to this topic sound quality has never been as big a deal to me as the fact that you can buy a bunch of shit tunes with way less financial risk and play the fuck out of them for a week or so...then what?

shit just got watered down a bit more..

[slothrop]

also, people chatting about how it sounds nicer on vinyl.. you think some turd tune dubstep producer X made on fruity loops is gonna sound better on vinyl? when it was made on a computer in the first place? it's not live music transfered from 8-tracks here is it, it's shitty throw away dance music most of the time, be honest with yourself, it's not like Skream was sitting in his flat messing around with loads of interesting analogue recording techniques when he made any of his tunes was he? it's just some cheap software on his mums laptop with a pair of sony headphones from tesco.

So music made on acoustic instruments and recorded on a reel to reel recorder is more worthy than a lone producer with a laptop set-up to make music from? i know loads of shit bands with shit demo's. The fact that software is cheap in comparison to full bands doesn't mean you can't compose a good tune, or produce music on par with pro studio's (and the warmth that comes with them).

Digital signal processing is so good these days (reaktor/Max/msp/Massive/numerous VST's) that i think you would be hard pushed to tell which audio is hardware and which is digital when produced well.

I think the point is that the "vinyl is better because wav turns the music into a stepped wave whereas vinyl will reproduce it as a lovely pure sounding sine wave (or whatever)" argument doesn't really work since pretty much 100% of dubstep will have been at least digitally recorded, and so all the vinyl can do is give a lovely pure sounding reproduction of the stepped waveform that the digital recorder sends to it.

And it's kind of balls anyway, people always visualize this like you're playing it back from a 3 bit audio file so the step function has about 8 steps, rather than 16 bit which has about 65000 steps. The dynamic range of a CD or a 16 bit wav is about 96dB, which means that if you took some 32 bit audio and bitcrushed it down to CD / wav quality, the difference would just about be theoretically perceptible once the volume was amped up to the level of a jackhammer. Going to 24 bit gives you more dynamic range than most mixing desks, and definitely enough that whatever system you play it on you aren't going to notice a difference.

I'm not saying that vinyl doesn't sound different, just that it's not as theoretically inevitable and clear cut as some people with GCSE maths try to make out.

[monstaman]

When it comes to Dubstep it's all about the vinyl. There's something about vinyl in the dubstep/d&b scene which makes the set seem a lot better. Whenever I go to a dubstep or drum and bass night and a Dj is using a laptop/CDJ I find that most people complain and start shouting 'USE SOME VINYLS'. It's probably down to the fact that most people who have got into this scene see vinyl as the norm.
I personally think that seeing the DJ mixing around on the decks and working with the vinyls is a lot more exciting than a guy staring at his laptop like he's on redtube, especially when it comes to the drop..
Saying this, dj'ing with mp3's so much more convenient. I'm all about the laptop when i'm mixing electro (hopefully getting a Lemur soon) but with Dubstep it just doesn't work for me.
For me the best thing about vinyl is getting in the post and telling your mates 'Mate just got this sweet vinyl from chemical records in the post today' instead 'Mate I downloaded a new mp3 from an obscure blog i found while i was bored. Schwiiing!!'