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laurend wrote:After reading the initial post many times, I still don't see any relevant info in it.
Changing the drum set is enough to make the specified levels just wrong because it's based on peak values.
I don't see any info related to mastering either.
Where the info?

It's best just to ignore it...

Thought I'd give this a bump.

I've noticed in a lot of the recent Joy O/Boddika bits and also in Kowton's new songs that they have this really raw sound but still seem to be pretty well mixed.

Now when I'm mixing I'll either get try everything nice and clean or go for a grimey /jukey feel and just experiment with compression, filtering and distortion to get a sound I'm happy with, but the aforementioned names seem to strike a great balance. Part of me just says it's raw sounds mixed well and I'm reading into it too much but if anyone has some tips for getting a really raw,clipped, but still clean sounds on minimal (referring to an aesthetic here, not a genre) housey tracks...

That Boddika & Joy O tune Can't find a digital release though

I think you're right, just raw sound / well mixed. Maybe some weird exciter/distortion combo on the bass.

I dont really get what you mean, I'd say both those tracks seem pretty rough round the edges to me, obvs the mix isnt bad, its not an uber cilit bang clean mix.

The rawness is obviously coming from the sample choice and any saturation that's been added. I think its the 'modern' mixing techniques that differentiate it from 'old' raw tunes. I.e good use of multiband compression, delays/ stereo wideners on hats etc, sidechaining and general good layering of kicks and snares with clean punchy samples.

skimpi wrote:I dont really get what you mean, I'd say both those tracks seem pretty rough round the edges to me, obvs the mix isnt bad, its not an uber cilit bang clean mix.

Basically I'm referring to the gap between these sorts of tunes and the mid-90's techno that inspire them; tips on giving very minimal drum driven tunes an edgy rawness without just getting a lofi sound, not referring to any specific mixing style just tips on achieving this balance.

So far I've found keeping the samples themselves pretty clean and just sticking about 6bd tape compression on the drum bus works quite well.
Bitrushers on the hats followed by some tight eq.
and for the more percussive sound ring mod and bit crushing are good.
Basically, being very sparing with actual saturation and distortion and relying more on subtle bitrushing, character compression and unusual filters/eq.

Joy O and Boddika record all there tracks to tape, so thats gonna factor the sound. Im guessing they and kowton both use alot of hardware and outboard effects.

I'd second that the use of bitcrushing, filters and character compression is important to achieve this sound.
You can go with regular distortion and saturation plug ins, but in my experience, you have do distort the sound very hard to get the desired amount of grit. By distorting the sound heavily, you usually strip it of it's original flavors. It's just more effective to use some light bitcrushing on the individual sounds (referring to percussive, non-bass elements) and then compress the group as a whole with desired amount of character and saturation.

Of course, the recording of tracks to tape add a lot. I really don't think these tracks have these sound qualities pre-master.

bump. maximum respect for this thread, learning a lot from it.

I like my drums to be very minimal to be honest.. Here's some uploaded examples of my kind of drums I like:

The Kicks
Soundcloud

The Hats.
Soundcloud

I've been obsessed with tech'y kinda stuff atm and finally managed to get a demo track down just trying out different techniques.

Soundcloud

It's a lot on the minimal side with a lot of automation doing the majority of the variation. For those interested here's a few things I did to get the sound:-

- The percussion (bongos etc) were played in through a sampler and then bounced to audio, parallel filtered through several different plugins and then bounced down again. (They must have gone through at least 8 different filters doing different things by the end of it.

- The kick is being sent to a delay which is being sidechained to the kick with another filter on it (this is automated into the intro by volume)

- Several delays and reverbs are automated through on the percussion and lead arpeggio thing.

- Bass was very simple, coupla squares sent to filters and distortion etc.

- A lot of sidechaining to everything, some things (like bass were sidechained harder with the lead instruments being compressed only slightly.

- The track I find to getting a grittier sound is using lots of layers of subtle filtering and distortion to make things sound more analogue.

- Oh yeah Chorus on the percussion as well, that seemed to help quite a bit.

- Having my sounds too clinical I've been told is one of my bigger weaknesses so focussing quite a bit on sorting this atm. Hopefully there's something in there for people who suffer the same problem.

^^^Sounds nice, really thick. Like the Zombyish triplets switch-up toward the end aswell.

When you say 'subtle filtering', are you referring to automating minimal changes in a LP or HP over time? Or else, what sort of filters and what type of modulation? Interested as i always try and make things sound as least digital as possible.

Lucifa wrote:^^^Sounds nice, really thick. Like the Zombyish triplets switch-up toward the end aswell.

When you say 'subtle filtering', are you referring to automating minimal changes in a LP or HP over time? Or else, what sort of filters and what type of modulation? Interested as i always try and make things sound as least digital as possible.

Cheers man, Combination of HP BP & LP being modulated in time to the music. When I say subtle it's just that I'm go for little bits of filtering spread out over different plugins instead of just whacking a LP filter taking out a huge chunk of the sound You just need a filter that has a 'mix' parameter so you can dial in how much of the sound you want to affect. If you don't have this then you can do a DIY by sending to a separate buss (same process as parallel compression)

like someone said earlier, boddikas tracks are put through tape, which actually makes a shitload of difference by adding harmonics etc,

alz wrote:like someone said earlier, boddikas tracks are put through tape, which actually makes a shitload of difference by adding harmonics etc,

HEY YOU! You stole my name. >.<

alz wrote:like someone said earlier, boddikas tracks are put through tape, which actually makes a shitload of difference by adding harmonics etc,

True, but if I run one of my tunes through a tape deck it's not going to sound like Boddika in the slightest.

AxeD wrote:

alz wrote:like someone said earlier, boddikas tracks are put through tape, which actually makes a shitload of difference by adding harmonics etc,

True, but if I run one of my tunes through a tape deck it's not going to sound like Boddika in the slightest.

Yeah, people definitely overlook how (relatively) subtle the whole tape thing is. I mean sure it makes a difference but it's not am obvious effect like on say Hype Williams or something.

outbound wrote:I've been obsessed with tech'y kinda stuff atm and finally managed to get a demo track down just trying out different techniques.

Soundcloud

It's a lot on the minimal side with a lot of automation doing the majority of the variation. For those interested here's a few things I did to get the sound:-

- The percussion (bongos etc) were played in through a sampler and then bounced to audio, parallel filtered through several different plugins and then bounced down again. (They must have gone through at least 8 different filters doing different things by the end of it.

- The kick is being sent to a delay which is being sidechained to the kick with another filter on it (this is automated into the intro by volume)

- Several delays and reverbs are automated through on the percussion and lead arpeggio thing.

- Bass was very simple, coupla squares sent to filters and distortion etc.

- A lot of sidechaining to everything, some things (like bass were sidechained harder with the lead instruments being compressed only slightly.

- The track I find to getting a grittier sound is using lots of layers of subtle filtering and distortion to make things sound more analogue.

- Oh yeah Chorus on the percussion as well, that seemed to help quite a bit.

- Having my sounds too clinical I've been told is one of my bigger weaknesses so focussing quite a bit on sorting this atm. Hopefully there's something in there for people who suffer the same problem.

Had a listen, nice tune. Not that into the Nathan Fakey sound myself but it's quality production.

Guys I need some help with my basses, I want to make it a bit midrange, but I have no idea where to start. Anyone mind helping out?
I mean something like this
Soundcloud

DMNSHN wrote:Guys I need some help with my basses, I want to make it a bit midrange, but I have no idea where to start. Anyone mind helping out?
I mean something like this
Soundcloud

Put some midrange in there then? haha, I dont know how to answer that question, just mess around with a synth till you get a sound that you want.