FABRICLIVE 37 - CASPA & RUSKO

[blizzardmusic]

Kinda sounds like it was a live set that they recorded.

wonder why its called fabricLIVE?

[rekordah]

fabriclive cds are studio mixes blizzard.

[blizzardmusic]

fabriclive cds are studio mixes blizzard.

oh

why are they called fabric live then?

[optimum]

fabriclive cds are studio mixes blizzard.

oh

why are they called fabric live then?

It's named after the club night that takes place every friday at fabric mate

[poax]

truth business

i know 2 other people that were asked before caspa and rusko , both on a tip at the complete other end of the spectrum .

average powers of deduction tell me that fabric dont no bubkiss about dubstep and simply were looking for prominent "stars" to push the cd, another bandwagon jumped on by the big dogs.

there was no consideration of the sound , just about getting the right names on the packaging .

no disrespect to caspa or rusko , but i think , personally, dubstep has become too big for clubs like Fabric to ignore, but none of the big clubs have done anything to support the music particularly.

Im glad that this cd has caused so much contention , i dont believe that it is a representation for "dubstep" and thats perfect because fabric isnt a representation of it either.

[joe muggs]

fabriclive cds are studio mixes blizzard.

Apparently not - Rusko said they did it all in 2 hours in the club (not while the club was open though)

[blackdown]

truth business

i know 2 other people that were asked before caspa and rusko , both on a tip at the complete other end of the spectrum .

average powers of deduction tell me that fabric dont no bubkiss about dubstep and simply were looking for prominent "stars" to push the cd, another bandwagon jumped on by the big dogs.

there was no consideration of the sound , just about getting the right names on the packaging .

no disrespect to caspa or rusko , but i think , personally, dubstep has become too big for clubs like Fabric to ignore, but none of the big clubs have done anything to support the music particularly.

Im glad that this cd has caused so much contention , i dont believe that it is a representation for "dubstep" and thats perfect because fabric isnt a representation of it either.

oh sh*t, poax just went and said it how it is!

i was harassing Fabric in 2004/5 to let hatcha mix one of these CDs, back when it would have been years ahead of its time. no reason why they should particularly listen to me, but with hindsight, that CD would have been ahead of its time...

[blizzardmusic]

fabriclive cds are studio mixes blizzard.

Apparently not - Rusko said they did it all in 2 hours in the club (not while the club was open though)

sorry for starting such a debate

[fused_forces]

Nang CD plus a big move for the dubstep scene.

Large up caspa an rusko.

[fushimi]

Caspa and rusko keep making these absurd tunes, that I keep telling myself are just them taking the piss a bit, but...they just keep on making em

Have you seen the tracklist for Distinction's new mix? Two new Rusko dubs called..."Get Ya Cock Out" and "Pint Face"! Cockney Thug was good but now they're deep into self-parody, albeit unconsciously. I hereby predict that Rusko and/or Caspa's future track names:

Double Ds
Pearl Necklace
Wankstain
Jizz Sucker
Cunty Cock Bollocks
Cockney Slag
Foreskin Fist Knobbler

[jred]

i can see peoples point of veiw in all but its a caspa n rusko mix cd ... its there thing, bangers is what there into and there both good at it because they obviously love it , i mean do any of you lot wana be dictated what you play nah course not ,if deeps your thing play deep ... its good to have people doing what they love instead of trying do what other people want all the time. when caspa played here in nz it was an onslaught and very different to alot of other dj,s playing in nz a welcome change ,im guessing things are different in the uk anywayyyyy my point is it was there thing they did it there way respect to em .

[joe muggs]

truth business

i know 2 other people that were asked before caspa and rusko , both on a tip at the complete other end of the spectrum .

average powers of deduction tell me that fabric dont no bubkiss about dubstep and simply were looking for prominent "stars" to push the cd, another bandwagon jumped on by the big dogs.

there was no consideration of the sound , just about getting the right names on the packaging .

no disrespect to caspa or rusko , but i think , personally, dubstep has become too big for clubs like Fabric to ignore, but none of the big clubs have done anything to support the music particularly.

Im glad that this cd has caused so much contention , i dont believe that it is a representation for "dubstep" and thats perfect because fabric isnt a representation of it either.

oh sh*t, poax just went and said it how it is!

i was harassing Fabric in 2004/5 to let hatcha mix one of these CDs, back when it would have been years ahead of its time. no reason why they should particularly listen to me, but with hindsight, that CD would have been ahead of its time...

Good on you for trying - but you can see why they didn't, right? For better or worse they're an international brand, and have to operate like one. A Hatcha CD in 2004/5 would have sold 4,000 copies or something, even with Fabric's marketing budget behind it... But now with C&R's tunes getting rinsed by DJs right across the D&B spectrum (which makes up half of Fabric's core constituency) and beyond, they can easily slot it into their musical branding and sell a LOT more than that. Fabric may not be clued-up beyond techno and D&B, but it's not their job to be: they know their audience, and they know what complements their brand.

OK in an ideal world I guess they should have got Benga with Coki or Hatcha to to it, to capitalise on 'Night', but the fact is that 'Cockney Thug' is more recognisable even than that track to your average D&B head / Zane Lowe listener / whatever... it's the 'Super Sharp Shooter' of Dubstep. I understand all the objections to this mix not giving a true picture of Dubstep, but it is only one in a continuing series of breakthroughs in reaching the more general music lovers - I mean, if Shackleton, or Oris, can play to (and demolish) thousands-strong crowds at festivals, then we know that the sound can work on a massive scale without necessarily needing rave riffs and movie samples. The only way this mix could 'damage' Dubstep is if you let it: too much worrying about whether it misrepresents or cheapens the scene just generates negativity; the fact is that it's done, it's out there, it represents one particular facet of the sound, the sort of tunes that are most understandable to d&b or rock kids and thus could attract them to investigate the wider world of dubstep... We all know that Caspa and Rusko are about much more than just that sound, and we know that Fabric is a commercial organisation which has clearly asked them to showcase their anthemic side, so really there is no point attacking either of them. Far better to accept it, move on, and think about how the scene's NEXT statement to the mainstream can represent other sounds and moods.

[poax]

please , dont anyone try and capitalise on night anymore.

Fair play to you Mugsy , fair play.

[blackdown]

Fabric may not be clued-up beyond techno and D&B, but it's not their job to be: they know their audience, and they know what complements their brand.

your rush into pragmatism is a tragic surrender of many of the ideals the dubstep scene stands for. you need to step back and look at the bigger picture bro.

all this talk of brands and demographics, corporations and commerce - it would be fine if we were talking about mobile phones or credit cards, but this is music. it's music that's not made for adverts or demographics, to sell 'units' or please advertisers. it's made by the dubstep community for the dubstep community. and that's what makes it strong.

Sure, dubstep's changed a lot in the last two years and I accept that money and commerce will play an increasing role in how the scene develops, esp with acts like Burial selling 20k copies or more, but there's no reason to rush to sell so much of what the scene stands for so quickly.

Poax mentions two acts who turned down the opportunity to mix this CD. Now I dont know specifically who they are, but it's clear that turning down an opportunity like that is a case where making the right business decision and making the right musical decision are in opposition.

As dubstep grows, people will increasingly need to make these hard calls. Strange as it might seem, sometimes saying 'yes' to the money wont always be the right thing to do in the long term.

[poax]

Fabric may not be clued-up beyond techno and D&B, but it's not their job to be: they know their audience, and they know what complements their brand.

your rush into pragmatism is a tragic surrender of many of the ideals the dubstep scene stands for. you need to step back and look at the bigger picture bro.

all this talk of brands and demographics, corporations and commerce - it would be fine if we were talking about mobile phones or credit cards, but this is music. it's music that's not made for adverts or demographics, to sell 'units' or please advertisers. it's made by the dubstep community for the dubstep community. and that's what makes it strong.

Sure, dubstep's changed a lot in the last two years and I accept that money and commerce will play an increasing role in how the scene develops, esp with acts like Burial selling 20k copies or more, but there's no reason to rush to sell so much of what the scene stands for so quickly.

Poax mentions two acts who turned down the opportunity to mix this CD. Now I dont know specifically who they are, but it's clear that turning down an opportunity like that is a case where making the right business decision and making the right musical decision are in opposition.

As dubstep grows, people will increasingly need to make these hard calls. Strange as it might seem, sometimes saying 'yes' to the money wont always be the right thing to do in the long term.

[pdomino]

... a case where making the right business decision and making the right musical decision are in opposition.

I like that.

[joe muggs]

your rush into pragmatism is a tragic surrender of many of the ideals the dubstep scene stands for. you need to step back and look at the bigger picture bro.

As dubstep grows, people will increasingly need to make these hard calls. Strange as it might seem, sometimes saying 'yes' to the money wont always be the right thing to do in the long term.

Maybe I wasn't clear enough about what I was saying. I wasn't suggesting that anybody *should* take on the mentality of "brands and marketing" at all; just saying that that is the scale and style with which Fabric operate, and criticising them for that would be like criticising an oil tanker for not being able to change direction instantly.

Yes I think pragmatism is a good thing, but not the way you've read it. This mix is now out, for better or worse; it's there and nobody's going to change that - the question is do people within dubstep ALLOW it to be the cause of unecessary drama (and I have already heard more than one person off the record call it "the death of dubstep" or very similar), or do they channel all that energy into shoring up and strengthening all that they feel is good about dubstep and present a more diverse and realistic picture to the casually interested onlooker (of which there are inevitably going to be more and more).

I've seen music styles and scenes in the past get ruined both by accepting every mainstream offer that comes along AND by clinging too much to the "by us for us, keep it underground" attitude. It's not as simple as one or the other, both have their hazards and benefits. Which is why it's good that this debate is going on, but the factors are different for every record / mix / tour / licensing deal / whatever. I mean what if, say, a major dance label offered to license 'Underwater Dancehall' and re-release it with a massive marketing budget? Would THAT be unrepresentative of dubstep, after all it's a vocal album? Would Pinch be wrong to take the money then? Every case is different.

It's good that there are strong opinions on all sides; the test for the community now is whether the energy of the debate turns into factionalism, or whether everyone concerned can take the lessons of the discussion and move on to use them creatively.

[blackdown]

no, again it's bigger picture time. i dont think the "big issue" is whether people will descend into factionalism - to be honest the scene's been made up of different factions from its inception, that's what keeps it musically diverse.

i think the bigger issue is whether what makes it similar (it's sense of community and identity, rather than its differences) will prevail on issues like how much an influence from commerce it should accept in the light of it's newfound success and audience...

[joe muggs]

no, again it's bigger picture time. i dont think the "big issue" is whether people will descend into factionalism - to be honest the scene's been made up of different factions from its inception, that's what keeps it musically diverse.

i think the bigger issue is whether what makes it similar (it's sense of community and identity, rather than its differences) will prevail on issues like how much an influence from commerce it should accept in the light of it's newfound success and audience...

Oh yes very definitely. I absolutely agree on that last part; that is the absolute key to how the scene and sound develop, as I suggested in the 'Dubstep Ethics' thread - and all the signs are good at the moment, for example in the way that the "community and identity" are generally translating naturally to new scenes as they spring up in countries and cities outside the UK.

I only brought up 'factionalism' specifically in relation to this CD and some of the comments that have been made about it.

[osk]

To both of you:

What a great little debate. This is how forums should be...

Keep it up. I'll get the popcorn.