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alien pimp wrote:

DRTY wrote: The Earth could continually sustain about 4.5 billion people, we currently have about 6 billion (I think), this is exponentially growing.

You can't grow food in alot of places, and there's not enough energy.

said who?
the same people working on terraforming the moon or mars? maybe those are more welcoming places for naives, hope they'll go there when they will be sold some bullcrap like this

Said a lot of the brightest scientists in the world. But it's really quite a simple issue to get your head around...

We know exactly what a human "needs" to survive (treating it as an animal with nutritional and space needs)... in fact, we've done massive amounts of research into it in order to allow humans to survive in space - the first thing you need to know when planning a Space Station is how much space each human needs and how much food and water you need to take with you.

It's a fairly simple sum to work out how much land is currently farmable and how much clean water is available. Once you get over "shock" statistics like "97% of the earth's surface is empty" and add in the fact that 70% of the surface is undrinkable saltwater that is also impossible to build on, you start to see exactly what problem the species faces.

It's quite simple maths - it doesn't take geniuses to understand the problem; it's the solutions that take the thought.

All you've got to do is keep this equation true: [Available Resources / Population] > Individual Human Need

Western consumption does need to drop significantly, but I think an overall drop in population (discouraging people from having more than one or two children - I'm not talking about anything more invasive than that, certainly nothing like China's policies) would make things a hell of a lot easier.

Lack of resources = war. There's no way around that... you've GOT to avoid it.

Maybe we should all be investing in this kind of technology...

http://www.gewater.com/what_we_do/water ... nation.jsp

wouldn't draining the seas be a really bad idea

magma wrote:
Lack of resources = war. There's no way around that... you've GOT to avoid it.

in the futures, wars will be fought over water, not oil. already countries are screwing up natural habitats in order to store water in massive quantities by building dams that drain some valleys of water and and flood others, starving and drowning the environment..

Desalination is ridiculously expensive and the consumers get charged an arm and a leg for it.

DRTY wrote:wouldn't draining the seas be a really bad idea

You'd be pretty hard pressed to drain a sea, dude.

And that's why I'm saying maybe we should all take a slice of the desalination pie, making it cheaper and more widespread. Take some positive capitalist action

The water that comes from your tap costs a lot of money to get it potable too.

DRTY wrote:

alien pimp wrote:

DRTY wrote: The Earth could continually sustain about 4.5 billion people, we currently have about 6 billion (I think), this is exponentially growing.

You can't grow food in alot of places, and there's not enough energy.

said who?
the same people working on terraforming the moon or mars? maybe those are more welcoming places for naives, hope they'll go there when they will be sold some bullcrap like this

What I'm saying is that it's going to be a problem in the future, not right now.

No one is terraforming Mars or the Moon?!?! Humans haven't reached Mars, and we've only tip toed on the moon...... but aren't you someone who believes we haven't been there anyway?

I don't understand how people can deny that overpopulation will be a problem, it's shockingly obvious. It happens all the time on smaller scales.

i didn't mean they are doing it now, i mean they are working on it, as in being in planning stage now, but that was ambiguos put by myself, sorry
if you don't understand what karmakazee explained, you can't understand anything, but that was proved before, so keep wondering about things

cityzen wrote:Water will be the first problem. People think "oo the worlds surface is mostly water, we'll be fine", well most of that water is salt water. The amount of "fresh" water that is actually drinkable is only 2%. Mexico City for one is already facing water shortages.... Yes we are overpopulated... now.

2% is million times more than we need

alien pimp wrote:
i didn't mean they are doing it now, i mean they are working on it, as in being in planning stage now, but that was ambiguos put by myself, sorry
if you don't understand what karmakazee explained, you can't understand anything, but that was proved before, so keep wondering about things

The bit in bold is how you talk to people.

The bit not in bold. Is just not necessary.

You actually said yourself you didn't read his first post lol, I did read it. And understand it. Don't try and side up to him, he quite clearly said he thinks overpopulation WILL be a huge problem. You are denying it altogether?!?!

It's like you think nothing bad ever happens.

i still dont see it
obviously land shortage isnt an issue then
food isnt a problem, if we put half as much money worldwide into food production/alternative more productive methods of farming etc than military spending........ its a no brainer

politicians and media saying population control is an issue are just trying to keep us in a permanent state of fear, yet again

hackman wrote:
politicians and media saying population control is an issue are just trying to keep us in a permanent state of fear, yet again

I think you're mis-reading.... the issue is that the media aren't reporting about it. It will be a massive problem, but it's just not being talked about. Badgers reply sounds about right (second post).

hackman wrote:politicians and media saying population control is an issue are just trying to keep us in a permanent state of fear, yet again

But they're not saying it. That's what this thread is about.

Food production is reliant on fertile land and, more than anything - availability of water. You can't drink or farm saltwater, so we're actually pretty limited as to how much agriculture we can effectively do.

The water crisis in America is about to become very real indeed in the next few decades.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/datablo ... world-data
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/special_repo ... 379083.stm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ClqUcScwnn8

do i need to keep posting links?

DRTY wrote:

alien pimp wrote:
i didn't mean they are doing it now, i mean they are working on it, as in being in planning stage now, but that was ambiguos put by myself, sorry
if you don't understand what karmakazee explained, you can't understand anything, but that was proved before, so keep wondering about things

The bit in bold is how you talk to people.

The bit not in bold. Is just not necessary.

You actually said yourself you didn't read his first post lol, I did read it. And understand it. Don't try and side up to him, he quite clearly said he thinks overpopulation WILL be a huge problem. You are denying it altogether?!?!

It's like you think nothing bad ever happens.

i read less than half then i bluffed. wrong, note to self: don't trust anyone, if they start well it doesn't mean they'll keep it that way
i don't get the part about how i talk to people
your appreciation about what's necessary is not necessary

it's like i was the guy who saw evil everywhere it's not, and all of a sudden - bam! i turned around 180 degrees
pfff, worrying!

hackman wrote:http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/datablo ... world-data
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/special_repo ... 379083.stm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ClqUcScwnn8

do i need to keep posting links?

only if the data is government approved, and then we can complain in other threads about what a shitty job the government does and how they fire specialists for not accepting to manipulate data

wronss

The fact anyone can deny it will be a problem is astounding. Think about it.......

Imagine a man and a woman, they exist on a 10m x 10m piece of land.

For a while it's fucking sweet, they they start reproducing, and eventually, they can't sustain the population with the limited resources.

Fundamentally, that's how simple it is.

The growth is growing itself..... There's more people, and they're reproducing at an ever faster, and more successful rate, AND people are living for longer, all these factors together surely lead to catastrophe. it's a no brainer.

rbnc wrote:

badger wrote:because it's not a story that will sell; and it's as simple as that. it doesn't fit into any of our current fear narratives.

I think it's more to do with that fact that people are scared about talking about immigration (which is the main cause of our population growth, as 50% of births in London last year where to people who had immigrated in the last 15 years, where as the current generation of British born [not just white but all British born] people are having less children..and later, don't let your perspective be slanted by teenage mums on Jeremy Kyle haha). Any party that does talk about immigration in a serious and tough way will immediately be labeled as racist or xenophobic in an attempt to smear at any given opportunity. Serious and tough Immigration talk so far is reserved for fruity nutters like the BNP and UKIP. Mainstream parties are still too scared.

not sure if you are aware, but the immigrants who gave birth in london didn't do it that much in their home country, so i guess it kinda balances out

hackman wrote:http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/datablo ... world-data
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/special_repo ... 379083.stm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ClqUcScwnn8

do i need to keep posting links?

They're about 10 years old, and from obscure sections of their websites..... I guess what I'm saying is why do we not get it hammered into us like we do things like global warming, afganistan etc etc. It's not exactly mainstream news? I just think it should be.