Speed of light broken?

[Mr Hyde]

mortal- that stuff you said is more a thing of questioning philosophy and epistemology, these people doing experiments at things like CERN are always questioning boundaries and limits and pre-existing knowledge anyway- its what they do!

[Shum]

Honestly, no. It's not something i've really read up on, the same with a lot of science. Essentially, i wouldnt say im an academic.

nor would i say its all a load of crap. its hard to get out exactly what im trying to say as i dont fully understand what im thinking.
But i'll try and write it in a way thats easier to read, and doesnt make me come across as a jackass.

What if its not the limit. We may have many studies and laws to say that YES, it is in fact the limit.
It would have a snowball effect, the more people believing in said theory, the more fortified it becomes, and therefore the harder it is to break free from.
its the same with anything. caveman touches fire, burns himself. caveman 2 looks on and see that touching the fire, causes burning.
this sets the belief, that burning will be the outcome. he touches it, and yes, burn. The belief then becomes stronger, it gets passed on as knowledge
and years and years on, it becomes deep-rooted within the brain. instincts are surely then just outcomes that were gradually fortified, ruling out the possibility of another outcome.
i dont know if what im saying will make sense as you read it...im essentially emptying my head here so it might not read well.
but i think you can get the point im aiming at.

im not telling you to believe me, only sharing my thoughts and how theyve come about.

usually whilst talking about a subject like this i wouldnt used terms and words like 'what if' and 'maybe'
as they are essentially only words of doubt, and therefore result in me doubting myself. but i did that time
as otherwise is comes off as an 'im right, youre wrong' versade. (versade is the wrong word there, cant think of a more suitable one)

anyway, i'll stop there, i find it hard to collect my thoughts and get them out properly on this subject.
however, if youd like to hear more, whether its to pick me apart or out of curiosity as to what the fucks going on in my head,
im more than willing to carry on.

Fair enough mate, I see where your coming from now.

[Gewze]

It would have a snowball effect, the more people believing in said theory, the more fortified it becomes, and therefore the harder it is to break free from.

that's not how science works.

science also doesn't take one experiment over nearly a century of research and evidence.

wait for Fermilab's corroboration, that's all we can do.

unless they got it wrong 15'000 times which is retarded and i highly doubt that because they must have done calibration tests before use. then surely the rule has been obliterated.

[Mortal]

It would have a snowball effect, the more people believing in said theory, the more fortified it becomes, and therefore the harder it is to break free from.

that's not how science works.

no, its how everything around you works.
Everything that does and does not work is down to your perception.

science can be helpful...although 99% of it is a giant kick in the balls that says 'no, no you cant do that'

[Pedro Sánchez]

Could mean good things for time travel. In 150 years or so.

Only one way mind, unless those in the future keep nipping back in time and are not telling us they are doing it nar, I don't think humanity will last longer enough to complete time travel.

[Dub_freak]

It would have a snowball effect, the more people believing in said theory, the more fortified it becomes, and therefore the harder it is to break free from.

that's not how science works.

no, its how everything around you works.
Everything that does and does not work is down to your perception.

science can be helpful...although 99% of it is a giant kick in the balls that says 'no, no you cant do that'

Nothing you have said in this thread has made any sense.

[Pedro Sánchez]

It would have a snowball effect, the more people believing in said theory, the more fortified it becomes, and therefore the harder it is to break free from.

that's not how science works.

no, its how everything around you works.
Everything that does and does not work is down to your perception.

science can be helpful...although 99% of it is a giant kick in the balls that says 'no, no you cant do that'

Nothing you have said in this thread has made any sense.

Thats just your perception

[knell]

unless they got it wrong 15'000 times which is retarded and i highly doubt that because they must have done calibration tests before use. then surely the rule has been obliterated.

calibrate something wrong once, you will get flawed results even if you test it a million trillion billion times

99% of it is a giant kick in the balls that says 'no, no you cant do that'

science only says that if you really and truly can't do something. that's how science works, it deals in facts


seriously though, it is very very very unlikely that fermilab will have the same results. saying that certain subatomic particles = tachyons would mean that you would be saying that causality is a myth. Pick up a ball and drop it... there's one experiment that says causality is not a myth. Oversimplified, but i hope you see my point.

[jugo]

science can be helpful...although 99% of it is a giant kick in the balls that says 'no, no you cant do that'

helpful: smelting metal (bronze, then iron, then steel), medicine, ink, steam power, electricity, the combustion engine, fertilizers, computers, etc...
giant kick in the balls: ?

science normally says 'hey, if you do this, this happens'.
other people try it, and say 'hey yeah, it does!' or 'nah, it doesn't'.
if everyone who tries it says 'yeah it does' then you have a theory.

no scientist will say this is an eternal truth. it's just a tested idea that hasn't been proven wrong yet.

[NilsFG]

3*sigma people, 3*sigma. This can easily be a fluke. Wait another few months before you open up that bottle of champagne.

Knell's on point btw.

Also, I can not forget how my old mechanics teacher, A. Sevrin (does lots of theoretical research about m-theory/string theory), once said: "When tachyons appear in your equations you know you're wrong."

[Mortal]

It would have a snowball effect, the more people believing in said theory, the more fortified it becomes, and therefore the harder it is to break free from.

that's not how science works.

no, its how everything around you works.
Everything that does and does not work is down to your perception.

science can be helpful...although 99% of it is a giant kick in the balls that says 'no, no you cant do that'

Nothing you have said in this thread has made any sense.

Thats just your perception

not quite.
i didnt expect anyone to understand, let alone consider it a possibility.

But i struggle to explain it at length and get across my point clearly at the same time, so its understandable.

After all the easier option is to just accept everything on the surface, and let the important sciency people work it all out for you.
Well, let them construct your reality for you.

i know i sound like a whack job, but if i dont speak confidently, i'll never believe it myself.

[Mortal]

no scientist will say this is an eternal truth. it's just a tested idea that hasn't been proven wrong yet.

Exactly. Yet everyone accepts it as the be all and end all. obviously some people delve deeper, thats where the progression comes from.
But is it not possible that it takes longer to chuck out old ideas and bring in new ones because so many people accept a law as a law, a limit as a limit?

helpful: smelting metal (bronze, then iron, then steel), medicine, ink, steam power, electricity, the combustion engine, fertilizers, computers, etc...
giant kick in the balls: ?

This, for me, goes on a much deeper level.
Im very thankful for inventions, medicines and the like.
But only because thats what im presented with in life.
I truly* believe that life is something like a lucid dream, you create the very existance around you.
The only reason you dont is because everything you and anyone else had learned stops you from realising this,
you accept it. I accept it, im not saying im better than anyone else and i can adjust my existance at will.
but im saying i believe its what is possible.

*i said truly here, wrong word choice...im still not entirely sure what i believe in, however its a possibility.
What i do truly believe is that the only limits we have, are the ones we've put in place. and there are a few things
that can stem off into.

EDIT: sorry knell, missed your bit

science only says that if you really and truly can't do something. that's how science works, it deals in facts

i understand what you mean there, and thats your opinion. But mine is that a lot of science, acts as a restriction as opposed to stating a fact.
Some of it, i agree with...a lot of my beliefs have stemmed from scientific fact. which sends me in loops i guess.
like ive said, i still dont completely know what i do and dont believe...but im getting there

[jugo]

this thread has turned into the web equivalent of porridge

[knell]

science only says that [you can't do something] if you really and truly can't do something. that's how science works, it deals in facts

i understand what you mean there, and thats your opinion.

that's not my opinion or anyone elses, it's the bloody definition of the scientific method

[JimmaJamJamie]

Really hope this is true but won't believe it is until it has been verified completely.

[Mortal]

science only says that [you can't do something] if you really and truly can't do something. that's how science works, it deals in facts

i understand what you mean there, and thats your opinion.

that's not my opinion or anyone elses, it's the bloody definition of the scientific method

You misunderstand me, that's your opinion on what actually exists.
Your outlook on life (from what ive gathered) is formed by a belief in science.

But say like we do go down the whole 'life is like a lucid dream' route.
Science then doesn't matter, nor does it actually affect whats happening around you.
you just believe it does so deeply to the extent that you make everything around you fit into those laws.
The fact is, everything happening around you is just the subconcious in your minds energy, projecting things into what then become your 'reality'

im not asking you to accept that, im only sharing ideas. Ones that i firmly believe are possible.




and if that were true, this is a dead end anyway, because im only arguing with my doubts, which are presented to me as another entity (yourself)

[pulsar]

i could have told you that Neutrino's faster than the speed of light

[ketamine]

99% sure it's mechanical error.

This.

[hasezwei]

it's probably an error, but knell don't be such a hardliner. after all that's not what science is about, a scientist will always consider the possibility of laws being wrong if you can prove it with repeatable results.

everything else would be

[deadly_habit]

don't know why people are so ready to chalk it up to an error with how little in the scheme of things we actually know about the universe, especially if this is true it could be the beginning of even more exciting discoveries and technological advancements, not to mention the potentials it has in the laws of physics and quantum mechanics
that being said it's great to see so many in the science community getting involved to verify or disprove it