Dubstepforum.com

If I want to see who produced something I just look it up. Takes two seconds.
As for scrolling through itoons, well, the search bar always comes in handy plus I always know what I want to listen to.

I see your point though. Horses for courses, but I feel you are in a shrinking minority.

Download culture is throwaway. I will never cherish the time I sat with my laptop and streamed a track off something sounding like fucking shite on youtube for the first time compared to breaking out a record just standing in front of the fi hi for the entire length of it listening to it and doing nothing else.

wolf89 wrote:Download culture is throwaway. I will never cherish the time I sat with my laptop and streamed a track off something sounding like fucking shite on youtube for the first time compared to breaking out a record just standing in front of the fi hi for the entire length of it listening to it and doing nothing else.

The other thing is that taking a chance moment when your in a 2nd hand record shop & they dont have listening deck. You take a chance & buy it then you gotta wait till you get home & can listen to it!

But that's what i'm saying - you're getting enjoyment out of tactile interaction of an object and then the music.

The music is what is (or should be) being judged, not how it's delivered to you.

Laszlo wrote:But that's what i'm saying - you're getting enjoyment out of tactile interaction of an object and then the music.

The music is what is (or should be) being judged, not how it's delivered to you.

But the music sounds better on the vinyl coming out of my nice set up than listening to it on my laptop on youtube. It's not just enjoying the ritual of playing the record it's that it facilitates a higher listening experience.

Can you fit you penis through the hole in your mp3, I think not.
Can wolf Fit his penis through the hole in his vinyl, YES!!!
Wolf Wins!!!

Laszlo wrote:But that's what i'm saying - you're getting enjoyment out of tactile interaction of an object and then the music.

The music is what is (or should be) being judged, not how it's delivered to you.

What you're saying is it doesnt matter how you listen to the same tune? Whether it be an MP3 played off an Iphone or a cd or a vinyl etc...

Put it this way.

Blade Runner on your phone vs blade runner in the cinema.

Does it make it a better or worse film? No. Are you going to enjoy it more in the cinema. Yeah of course.

wolf89 wrote:

Laszlo wrote:But that's what i'm saying - you're getting enjoyment out of tactile interaction of an object and then the music.

The music is what is (or should be) being judged, not how it's delivered to you.

But the music sounds better on the vinyl coming out of my nice set up than listening to it on my laptop on youtube. It's not just enjoying the ritual of playing the record it's that it facilitates a higher listening experience.

But were not discussing yt and laptop speakers. We're talking about vinyl vs flac or wav. All things being equal (ie the system) most people will find no difference other than price.

defoxster wrote:

Laszlo wrote:But that's what i'm saying - you're getting enjoyment out of tactile interaction of an object and then the music.

The music is what is (or should be) being judged, not how it's delivered to you.

What you're saying is it doesnt matter how you listen to the same tune? Whether it be an MP3 played off an Iphone or a cd or a vinyl etc...

No, i'm talking about how a cd inlay or vinyl sleeve has no bearing on how a piece of music sounds.

Laszlo wrote:

wolf89 wrote:

Laszlo wrote:But that's what i'm saying - you're getting enjoyment out of tactile interaction of an object and then the music.

The music is what is (or should be) being judged, not how it's delivered to you.

But the music sounds better on the vinyl coming out of my nice set up than listening to it on my laptop on youtube. It's not just enjoying the ritual of playing the record it's that it facilitates a higher listening experience.

But were not discussing yt and laptop speakers. We're talking about vinyl vs flac or wav. All things being equal (ie the system) most people will find no difference other than price.
.

Still sounds better and regardless of if it bears any relevance on the quality of the music everything else enhances the experience and so is a benefit of the format. So while format is less important the music (duh) the format in itself can offer bonus qualities that mean it is relevant to the experience.

Besides everyone out there is ignorant to it all. They will have shitty lossy formats and listen on laptops instead of buying a hi-fi and making windows rattle after getting excited playing a new record. They will buy beats headphones, they won't google production credits. Digital formats have spawned a terrible musical culture.

wolf89 wrote:Still sounds better and regardless of if it bears any relevance on the quality of the music everything else enhances the experience and so is a benefit of the format. So while format is less important the music (duh) the format in itself can offer bonus qualities that mean it is relevant to the experience.

Like I say, most people can't hear a difference. That doesn't bode well for the future of vinyl.
As for your second point, obviously that is your opinion, but I see the music and the album art as two separate experiences mostly not created by the same artist.

Also, small point, digital does come with the artwork..

wolf89 wrote:

Laszlo wrote:

wolf89 wrote:

Laszlo wrote:But that's what i'm saying - you're getting enjoyment out of tactile interaction of an object and then the music.

The music is what is (or should be) being judged, not how it's delivered to you.

But the music sounds better on the vinyl coming out of my nice set up than listening to it on my laptop on youtube. It's not just enjoying the ritual of playing the record it's that it facilitates a higher listening experience.

But were not discussing yt and laptop speakers. We're talking about vinyl vs flac or wav. All things being equal (ie the system) most people will find no difference other than price.
.

Still sounds better and regardless of if it bears any relevance on the quality of the music everything else enhances the experience and so is a benefit of the format. So while format is less important the music (duh) the format in itself can offer bonus qualities that mean it is relevant to the experience.

Besides everyone out there is ignorant to it all. They will have shitty lossy formats and listen on laptops instead of buying a hi-fi and making windows rattle after getting excited playing a new record. They will buy beats headphones, they won't google production credits. Digital formats have spawned a terrible musical culture.

Both are good points. I get where you are both coming from... I always find the money thing a bit of a weird one cos loads of people say its expensive buying vinyl etc but if you look at it like this - A coffee from somewhere like starbucks costs you about £4 & lasts all of about 10 mins. A record costs £8(ish) & you will get hours upon hours of enjoyment from it. So i think its just looking at how you want to spend your money.

Buying music for the artwork is like paying a hooker to babysit your kids.

Personally I can say it does get expensive when you're in the states and buying dance music as you generally have to order in bulk from overseas to offset currency conversion and shipping fees. Honestly I agree with him when it comes to it making no sense if the label is seeing no profit.
My turning point was not only convenience for snagging wavs or flac at a lesser price, but not being forced to purchase a B side or say 3 more tunes off an EP I had no interest in.

Laszlo wrote:

wolf89 wrote:Still sounds better and regardless of if it bears any relevance on the quality of the music everything else enhances the experience and so is a benefit of the format. So while format is less important the music (duh) the format in itself can offer bonus qualities that mean it is relevant to the experience.

Like I say, most people can't hear a difference. That doesn't bode well for the future of vinyl.
As for your second point, obviously that is your opinion, but I see the music and the album art as two separate experiences mostly not created by the same artist.

Also, small point, digital does come with the artwork..

Not really. There's a difference between a little square in the corner of itunes and holding 12" sized picture of some epic battle that the concept album you're listening to is about.

Besides yeah the music is still the same but the point is the format is better. A nicer sound with a a load of added bonuses and a better general experience does mean that the format is superior regardless of the music being the same.The way you make it sound is that enjoying a format more than another somehow makes the music less important.

Besides I think the whole way people listen to music now is often fucking stupid anyway and that is a product of modern formats. Fuck low quality mp3s on laptop speakers. Fuck the flicking through it on youtube for 30 seconds to decided if you like it attitude so many people have.

Genevieve wrote:Buying music for the artwork is like paying a hooker to babysit your kids.

Not buying it for the artwork. Saying that the artwork is nice to have making the format better (not affecting the quality of the music, just adding something extra to the overall experience). Enjoying the format doesn't mean to shift focus from the music.

It's more like fucking a hooker who turns up wearing a bin bag vs fucking a hooker who turned up in sexy lingerie. You still stuck your dick in someone but the general experience was better

Factor in that my turntables with my cartridges playing an old blues record sounds better than a cdr of a 320 in my cdj and it's a no brainer.

deadly habit wrote:Personally I can say it does get expensive when you're in the states and buying dance music as you generally have to order in bulk from overseas to offset currency conversion and shipping fees. Honestly I agree with him when it comes to it making no sense if the label is seeing no profit.
My turning point was not only convenience for snagging wavs or flac at a lesser price, but not being forced to purchase a B side or say 3 more tunes off an EP I had no interest in.

That's dance music though. I buy music digitally like this for these exact reasons. However an immense sounding double album on Southern Lord is going to get me spending £25 for it.

Yeah I didn't actually mean to make a point. I just laughed at my own analogy.

@defoxster - If I had started collecting vinyl when I was a teenager I would have a sick collection but nowhere to move in my home. I also wouldn't have been able to afford travelling around the world and seeing what i've seen or experience what I have. I still have a sick music collection ( ) but it all fits on a few shelves and a hard drive the size of my hand. If I want to swing a cat around, I can.

I also don't drink coffee.

@Wolf - Point one - The little square in the corner of itoons can be, wait for it, maximised. Depending on the size of your screen it could even be larger than 12".
Point two - "A nicer sound"... says you. Most people disagree. We covered that.
Three - No, the way I make it sound is that Hype has a point.

i buy vinyl so i can remember what music i liked 30-40 years from now. my hard drive isn't gonna survuve that long. having a physical copy just feels so much better than a file you see on a screen.