Dubstep joins DnB down a dead end alley

deamonds · Post by **deamonds** » Sun Jan 20, 2008 3:22 pm

Joe C wrote: I mean just check out whats going on in Bristol right now, absolutely nuts shit!

X2, Bristol is the biggest thing right now...

fearless · Post by **fearless** » Sun Jan 20, 2008 3:34 pm

Just as much as I wish "wobble" would go away, I wish threads like these would go away. The point being, get over it already. Try and stay with what you consider to be "good" at the moment and simply let things take their course. Not hating here, just offering advice.

ocr · Post by **ocr** » Sun Jan 20, 2008 3:37 pm

deamonds wrote:
Joe C wrote: I mean just check out whats going on in Bristol right now, absolutely nuts shit!

X2, Bristol is the biggest thing right now...

absolutely, i agree

ocr · Post by **ocr** » Sun Jan 20, 2008 3:41 pm

Fearless wrote:Just as much as I wish "wobble" would go away, I wish threads like these would go away. The point being, get over it already. Try and stay with what you consider to be "good" at the moment and simply let things take their course. Not hating here, just offering advice.

erm..isn't that last bit exactly what ive been saying since the start of this thread.....

Horza · Post by **Horza** » Sun Jan 20, 2008 4:11 pm

Fearless wrote:Just as much as I wish "wobble" would go away, I wish threads like these would go away. The point being, get over it already. Try and stay with what you consider to be "good" at the moment and simply let things take their course. Not hating here, just offering advice.

A forum is here for discussions, whether positive or negative. If we can't do that here where can we do it!

You can look at the urban music industry like the gaming market (Geeky I know but I really couldnt resist!

) They're some absolutely mind-blowing games out there but to get them you've really gotta sieve through the sh!t!

shonky · Post by **shonky** » Sun Jan 20, 2008 4:17 pm

Corpsey wrote:I dunno man, I feel like if the genre does go to shit then fuck the genre... the problem with it is almost that it IS a genre.

Yup.

Corpsey wrote:Seeing Kode and Martyn the other night, a lot of it was dubstep but not really the sort of thing dubstep has become seen as. Now, either the scene allows for the accomodation of that, or that thing splits off from the scene and supports itself. But the fact that I saw these two amazing sets at FWD definitely says something positive about the flexibility of the dubstep in 2008.

I'd definitely like a return to producers really pushing the boundaries of what's permissable within dubstep and bringing in ideas from all over. It'd be more interesting if dj's started incorporating music from outside the confines of dubstep to show what's possible as Kode 9 and various other dj's are trying to do. Seems like there's way more hostility to other music's up here than there was a few years back (hardcore, dnb, niche, house, anything that appears in the charts have all been slagged quite recently).

When you're getting people that have heard a couple of "insert big name dubstep dj here" sets and then deciding that something that isn't halfstep "isn't dubstep" it makes life more difficult for producers doing something interesting that doesn't fit in that mould. It seems that a great deal of people won't try something different until someone high up in the dubstep heirarchy has tried it and it becomes acceptable, which to me means either a/ they don't have any ideas of their own so can only really copy what's gone before (their goal might actually to be making something that sounds like their heroes' tunes of course) or b/ have ideas of their own but don't have enough courage in their convictions.

Anyway, big up the open-minded punters, dj's and producers that are pushing things in new directions.

Horza · Post by **Horza** » Sun Jan 20, 2008 4:20 pm

Shonky wrote:
Corpsey wrote:I dunno man, I feel like if the genre does go to shit then fuck the genre... the problem with it is almost that it IS a genre.
Yup.

Corpsey wrote:Seeing Kode and Martyn the other night, a lot of it was dubstep but not really the sort of thing dubstep has become seen as. Now, either the scene allows for the accomodation of that, or that thing splits off from the scene and supports itself. But the fact that I saw these two amazing sets at FWD definitely says something positive about the flexibility of the dubstep in 2008.
I'd definitely like a return to producers really pushing the boundaries of what's permissable within dubstep and bringing in ideas from all over. It'd be more interesting if dj's started incorporating music from outside the confines of dubstep to show what's possible as Kode 9 and various other dj's are trying to do. Seems like there's way more hostility to other music's up here than there was a few years back (hardcore, dnb, niche, house, anything that appears in the charts have all been slagged quite recently).

When you're getting people that have heard a couple of "insert big name dubstep dj here" sets and then deciding that something that isn't halfstep "isn't dubstep" it makes life more difficult for producers doing something interesting that doesn't fit in that mould. It seems that a great deal of people won't try something different until someone high up in the dubstep heirarchy has tried it and it becomes acceptable, which to me means either a/ they don't have any ideas of their own so can only really copy what's gone before (their goal might actually to be making something that sounds like their heroes' tunes of course) or b/ have ideas of their own but don't have enough courage in their convictions.

Anyway, big up the open-minded punters, dj's and producers that are pushing things in new directions.

This man only speaks truth! Listen up you frauds wheres your original soul!

oddfellow · Post by **oddfellow** » Sun Jan 20, 2008 4:21 pm

I think ultimately this is the fate of any genre. I think the only difference with dubstep is that its come about at a point in time when we are all able to use the internet and discuss its progression on a day to day basis. This has its benefits, as this particular topic has been noted before and discussed and from reading the replies it seems a great deal of people still want things to move forward and adapt. Also, there is still plently of wonderful bass/140 music being produced. Its all good

ocr · Post by **ocr** » Sun Jan 20, 2008 4:31 pm

A forum is here for discussions, whether positive or negative. If we can't do that here where can we do it!

exactly, just to reiterate :

there's a lot of music headz on here, a lot who've seen DnB rise and fall and who now enjoy the creative output within Dubstep (whatever people think "dubstep" is!)

I'm just curious to see to what extent (if any) other people see this thing mirroring the creative surge we saw in DnB coupled with the disposable pap that also overewhlemed the scene back then. I see a lot of similarities and i think its interesting.

If anyone isn't interested enough to discuss then thanx for dropping in to tell us all you're above threads like this, duly noted. Were you truly above it then we wouldnt hear from you at all as you'd have fallen over somewhere cause you cant even be bothered with being upright you're so laid back & unaffected by such paltry matters:)

I just find it interesting having been so absorbed in & protective over the drum n bass scene when i was younger and i haven't felt like that about a new emergent music form until Dubstep came along, maybe a little when UK garage emerged but we all saw what happened there.

ocr · Post by **ocr** » Sun Jan 20, 2008 4:38 pm

Shonky wrote:

Anyway, big up the open-minded punters, dj's and producers that are pushing things in new directions.

Tomity wrote:

Also, there is still plently of wonderful bass/140 music being produced. Its all good

yes! yes...and thrice yes.

shonky · Post by **shonky** » Sun Jan 20, 2008 4:39 pm

ocr wrote:I just find it interesting having been so absorbed in & protective over the drum n bass scene when i was younger and i haven't felt like that about a new emergent music form until Dubstep came along, maybe a little when UK garage emerged but we all saw what happened there.

Well apart from the gun business, and some shitty chart hits (I quite liked a few of the tunes that charted though - popular doesn't have to mean shit), it was probably more open to influences than dubstep is now and spawned grime, dubstep and niche.

So yeah appalling record, shocking really

ocr · Post by **ocr** » Sun Jan 20, 2008 4:46 pm

well...yeah, to be fair there's big gaps in my knowledge of that scene, i was just scared off it quickly and Im in no way an authority, in fact its been amazing how much I've had the blanks filled in by getting into recent music and looking back to the garage that influenced it. Its been great.

it was probably more open to influences than dubstep is now and spawned grime, dubstep and niche.

yeah im aware of this of course but it was

the gun business, and some shitty chart hits

that bugged me.

overcast radio · Post by **overcast radio** » Sun Jan 20, 2008 4:48 pm

First off, someone link me to some Bristol stuff.

The genres aren't broken...I think the key is seeing how all new tweaks of any electronic/loop-based/sound-system music come and go. DnB went thru it's rises and falls, got stretched every which way, and faded. When you take away songwriting (lyrics and melody) as a fundamental structure (which most other pop music is) you are in a sense limited to the stretching of genre.

The UK has always been a forward thinking culture in music, so I agree it's not limited to modern electronic based non-songwriting loop-based styles. Look at the UFO days of the 60's.

The only thing separating "electronic" music nowadays is the songwriting structure. Musical terms come and go with the times; because we (the world) as culture sell, distribute, write, and talk about music, the terms get very quick, and sometimes not wholly precise. "Dubstep" does a great job describing this music in one made up word...but it is deeper and truly has more explanation.

Look at the Native Tongues movement in hip-hop from like 1988-1994. That seemed huge, unstoppable, the next thing, the last stop in evolution. Like all other orbits, we have day and night, yeah? Look at glitch, lo-fi, click house, etc. Five years ago all you heard were small inimate beats of linty, clicky, fuzzy, mid-tempo blip-hop. Depends what culture yr in too; the reggaeton feel/tempo is everywhere in NYC.

You have all kinds of producers out there. I myself don't use third party loops, or anything pre-fab at all. All my beats are played/programmed from scratch. All the instruments. I have alarmingly little amounts of gear. But that's my sound too. I was also a staff composer at a well known house/studio/lib in NYC that encouraged me (although maybe didn't wholly practice themselves) to experiment. Because technology is so good, you get a new population of drag-and-drop types, weekend warriors that claim to be producers because they slapped together someone else's loops. These are hobbyists, not true producers, to me. But, these are the times.

I forgot who said it, maybe Cocteau, but nothing gets staler, quicker, than the avant-garde.

I'm having trouble thinking of any "electronic" genre that's brand new and has stayed around. Truly the only that changes seems to be sound/timbre. A groove is a groove and has some parent genre no matter what. Disco, funk, and reggae being those parent-genres.

I guess I'm saying don't be surprised when dubstep seems corny. It's OK, all electronic music has to go through this rite of passage. It will be back. All living things live in cycles, and music is a living, evolving thing. all we can do as producers is create our own worlds. If we deliver that world to a sound-system or other place lacking in traditional musical instruments/performers, so be it. Would you try to stand out and be original, whether with a guitar, turntable, or laptop?

*Didn't edit so this might be ineloquent writing but the point remains:)

the wiggle baron · Post by **the wiggle baron** » Sun Jan 20, 2008 4:53 pm

Bristol stuff = labels like tectonic, punch drunk and skull disco. Some criminally good stuff comes out on those labels.

Theres also the hench crew (headhunter, jakes, wedge, whiteboi kommonazmuk and mc scorpio - not 100% about that list, might be more)

Bristol is rapidly becoming my favourite place in the country!

Horza · Post by **Horza** » Sun Jan 20, 2008 5:02 pm

The point is clear Overcast Radio, nice one for laying it down so well! Me and a friend where on about this last night, stuff never dies it just fades from the limelight and gets a new set of tricks up its sleeve for its comeback extravaganza. Ok, I admit, not as poetic as you put it but its going in the same direction (I hope lol)

ocr · Post by **ocr** » Sun Jan 20, 2008 5:02 pm

Thank you Overcast Radio.

Bristol:

http://www.immerserecords.com

peverelist

forsaken

pinch

(many others but maybe someone could PM them to you or i will if get chance to come up with some more links/producers etc.)

www.rootedrecords.co.uk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=etjAm3gfXjQ

http://www.dubstepforum.com/viewtopic.p ... ht=#457321

south3rn · Post by **south3rn** » Sun Jan 20, 2008 5:33 pm

dubstep didn't start getting weak till the iron fist started tightening around here

our creativity is being censored on the board, and it's being reflected by us being scared to do anything new and shocking in fear of being reprimanded by the "man."

when no one gave a fuck about what anyone said is when the best tunes were being made.

think about that...

shonky · Post by **shonky** » Sun Jan 20, 2008 5:38 pm

South3rn wrote:dubstep didn't start getting weak till the iron fist started tightening around here

our creativity is being censored on the board, and it's being reflected by us being scared to do anything new and shocking in fear of being reprimanded by the "man."

when no one gave a fuck about what anyone said is when the best tunes were being made.

think about that...

Deep

or incredibly sarcastic, so difficult to tell in these post-ironic times

south3rn · Post by **south3rn** » Sun Jan 20, 2008 5:41 pm

lol i don't think the two are necessarily connected

but i deeply dislike both

pompende · Post by **pompende** » Sun Jan 20, 2008 5:43 pm

Shonky wrote:Deep

or incredibly sarcastic, so difficult to tell in these post-ironic times

what? isn't this whole thread a piss-take?

esp the bit in the beginning about not being able to find any similar threads

Dubstep joins DnB down a dead end alley

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