dj vs producer

jolly wailer · Post by **jolly wailer** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 4:15 pm

jack of all trades master of none..

it just takes a lil longer to get good at both.. I find personally that I when I'm tired of trying to produce I get into DJ'ing for its simple pleasure and instant gratification, then I tire of the tunes I own and find myself getting back into making new music on the production end of things..

back and forth, all the while getting better at both - I think its making me more well rounded in general

hurlingdervish · Post by **hurlingdervish** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 4:20 pm

there will be no room for dj's once live electronic music really takes off.

alright maybe there will be, but it will be more fun to see people making tunes live

3za · Post by **3za** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 4:33 pm

i've never DJ'ed. i dont get why some people think your not allowed to produce if you don't DJ. i think it should be the other way round produce then DJ so then you can play YOUR OWN TUNES. i think people who DJ do it for the instant respect, but all their doing is playing a tune some one eles made. i would love to do a live music thing in the future.

alphacat · Post by **alphacat** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 4:45 pm

Producer is the architect.

DJ is the interior decorator.

michaelvman · Post by **michaelvman** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 5:16 pm

Alphacat wrote:Producer is the architect.

DJ is the interior decorator.

So DJs are gay?

I used to be well on top with my mixing until i took producing abit more seriously. To be honest though learning to mix to a minimum standard for gigs takes less effort than learnin to produce to a professional standard for tracks to actually sound decent at the gigs.

jolly wailer · Post by **jolly wailer** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 5:21 pm

I actually prefer the fact that DJs just let tunes play out as the original producer intended them to be played..

the real time dicking-around business just always comes off sounding

imo

hurlingdervish · Post by **hurlingdervish** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 5:27 pm

Jolly Wailer wrote:I actually prefer the fact that DJs just let tunes play out as the original producer intended them to be played..

the real time dicking-around business just always comes off sounding

imo

yea but for how long? its only a matter of time. and "the way the producer intended" is kind of b/s because i think most producers wouldnt mind their tracks remixed live.

go watch flying lotus live, or daedulus or any of that crew. they are reinventing the game.

dj's days are numbered

-dubson- · Post by **-dubson-** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 5:30 pm

make tunes, get good at making tunes through practice and experience, get gigs cause of your tunes, get good at djing through practicing alot and playing out.

thats my theory anyway

jolly wailer · Post by **jolly wailer** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 5:34 pm

I actually just saw daedalus live this past friday and I thought it was pretty shit lol ..

hurlingdervish · Post by **hurlingdervish** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 5:41 pm

the only problem with playing out electronic music live is everyone is used to the overcompressed super mastered shit that everyone is putting out with 1000 hours of post production. right now live isnt THAT fantastic but at least they are tryin. you cant improvise a prerecorded track... the closest to improvisation is a dj picking songs over a 2 hour set. big woop. i'd rather see people sweating by the second trying to figure out what loop to drop next what bass sound to play what chords to play etc etc. you can say that djing sounds better, but theres definately not as much soul as someone trying to bring it to you live and direct. see: jazz music

raymond ford · Post by **raymond ford** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 5:52 pm

five-ohh-what wrote:a producer with dj skillz is going to make tracks that are easy to mix keep doing both

QFT nothing is worse than a track that drops in all the wrong places

and to add: They also know what the dancefloor wants.

jolly wailer · Post by **jolly wailer** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 5:55 pm

I agree with what yr saying re: in-the-moment musicality

but - dude was running all his tracks with a reactable (or something like that) and a macbook and the amount of digital artifacts that were coming through the sound system just made the entire set unlistenable, the guys using cdj's before him had alot more clarity in their sound

to me if yr gonna present your sound to a live audience on large sound you want that to be as crispy as possible, especially if you are a touring artist with a reputable name

so for now, I'll take sound quality over live performance, thats just alot more important to me when I go out for a night

hurlingdervish · Post by **hurlingdervish** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 6:09 pm

i would say that the reactable is a joke haha

i think that the innovation that will take it to the next level will be affordable microsoft surface like table with applications like ableton live. you could have one guy making loops and another mixing them dj- style on the surface making sure they are ready, eq-ed and that kind of thing.

djs could still be dj's but doing it with live audio

sigbowls · Post by **sigbowls** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 6:14 pm

im suprised turntables dont have efects like guitars have

or do they

Brisance · Post by **Brisance** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 6:17 pm

just chuck guitar pedals or effect mixers in your rig and you're set

jolly wailer · Post by **jolly wailer** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 6:18 pm

mm its not exactly a reactable tho.. I can't recall what this bit of kit is called, like a 16 x 16 light-up blip matrix, sixteen different tracks going up and down and tracked by a blip that moves across the 16 horizontal buttons, looks cool as tho

hurlingdervish · Post by **hurlingdervish** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 6:27 pm

Jolly Wailer wrote:mm its not exactly a reactable tho.. I can't recall what this bit of kit is called, like a 16 x 16 light-up blip matrix, sixteen different tracks going up and down and tracked by a blip that moves across the 16 horizontal buttons, looks cool as tho

oh thats an early monome

alphacat · Post by **alphacat** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 6:37 pm

This subject - the future of performance in electronic music - is something I've thought long & hard about, as I'm sure many of you have as well.

Because for better or worse, it's still in its infancy performance-wise, and I dunno if DJing is necessarily going to be the future for all electronic music: rather, I think DJing is it's own tangent that will continue to develop according to different demands and such.

Meanwhile, electronic artists do stuff like laptop rock (which is almost always fucking BORING) or pretend to play along to clicktracks where they add a couple notes over the top of a pre-recorded mix (BORING and insulting) - and yet the mediocre local pub band (that plays Nirvana covers for fratboys) as much as they suck, are still more visually compelling to most people than any laptop rocker...

...why is this?

It's because of the hardware interface with humans, so to speak.

The sounds an electric guitar makes don't come from someone just pushing a button; there's lots of physical nuance that goes into playing a guitar live, and that's what's interesting to watch.

As Eno once said, the problem with much electronic music is that it all boils down to a single button on a single mouse - all that creativity, direction, energy - filtered through that one little plastic button. Something's bound to be lost in translation!

I had this very discussion with a former employee of DigiDesign one night in a bar and it turned into a heated argument: he and his friends made 'electronic music' but because of this lack of performing visual appeal decided that when they played live, they would (A) wear clown suits, and (B) play only analog instruments configured to sound electronic (guitars through rackmount FX, a drummer with a click, etc.)...

This guy said that his approach was clearly the only logical one, while I took exception and said it looked like a vote of no-confidence in the music to my eyes. In fact, I told him his approach was going backwards and that his "band" was like a fake raver's version of Insane Klown Posse. He took exception to that. By the way, they really sucked on all levels, musical and performance.

In the end, I think the thing we've gotta re-evaluate is what gave rise to the music in the first place - technology. Technology gave us the tools to make electronic music, and technology will be what provides us the means to create a new visual form to accompany this music.

What will it look like?

Hell if I know.

But the things that were important to creating an engaging live performance for the last few hundred years are still important - the audience, the atmosphere, all that stuff - they just haven't all been taken into account yet.

Yet.

hurlingdervish · Post by **hurlingdervish** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 7:05 pm

im still waiting for a standardized midi guitar that doesnt run horn and bongo sounds off of a pedal module

is a square wave guitar too much to ask?

3za · Post by **3za** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 7:09 pm

Alphacat wrote:As Eno once said, the problem with much electronic music is that it all boils down to a single button on a single mouse - all that creativity, direction, energy - filtered through that one little plastic button. Something's bound to be lost in translation!

thats rubbish my mouse has got 2 buttons and a wheel.

plus i got a keyboard with pads, knobs and sliders.

dj vs producer

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