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magma wrote:

Pistonsbeneath wrote:It's a shame that most people go out for those reasons as it means bad music can get popular (whatever bad music is...it gives it an equal chance)

Meh... there's craploads of good music out there. If you go to a decent clubnight, you'll only be confronted with this sort of thing for one or two sets of the night anyway... and you can probably go and see something else in the second room.

Bad music is practically non-existant outside of the listeners head... beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I'm sure this tune means an awful lot to some people... I just like seeing people have fun with music, it's what it's for. Elitism really is terribly dull.

this is why i said (whatever bad music is)

fun is subjective too...fun is different things to different people...I don't find it fun seeing a load of stupid hat wearing, chortling, cokehead, fickle, painfully posh & loud, jamaican slang using 18 year olds getting in my face lol...this wanker put his drink on the subwoofer ffs...shockingly it fell over and all the coats on it got soaked....he just walked off...he wanted to have fun obviously and look cool...clearly clearing up mess he made wasn't on his agenda...i did it instead glaring at him but he just turned away...this sums up the kind of people I am talking about....this music attracts these types

I don't think I am elitist...certainly not anymore than all the well spoken teenagers complaining of too many 'chavs' being present....HELLO these people you think are 'chavs' invented this music you deluded cretins...fuck off to your klaxons concert and leave decent genres alone....

you think that's unreasonable because it's just based on my experience?

Pistonsbeneath wrote:

magma wrote:

Pistonsbeneath wrote:It's a shame that most people go out for those reasons as it means bad music can get popular (whatever bad music is...it gives it an equal chance)

Meh... there's craploads of good music out there. If you go to a decent clubnight, you'll only be confronted with this sort of thing for one or two sets of the night anyway... and you can probably go and see something else in the second room.

Bad music is practically non-existant outside of the listeners head... beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I'm sure this tune means an awful lot to some people... I just like seeing people have fun with music, it's what it's for. Elitism really is terribly dull.

this is why i said (whatever bad music is)

fun is subjective too...fun is different things to different people...I don't find it fun seeing a load of stupid hat wearing, chortling, cokehead, fickle, painfully posh & loud, jamaican slang using 18 year olds getting in my face lol...this wanker put his drink on the subwoofer ffs...shockingly i fell over and all the coats on it got soaked....he just walked off...he wanted to have fun obviously and look cool...clearly clearing up mess he made wasn't on his agenda...i did it instead glaring at him but he just turned away...this sums up the kind of people I am talking about....this music attracts these types

I don't think I am elitist...certainly not anymore than all the well spoken teenagers complaining of too many 'chavs' being present....HELLO these people you think are 'chavs' invented this music you deluded cretins...fuck off to your klaxons concert and leave decent genres alone....

you think that's unreasonable because it's just based on my experience?

No, I don't, but I also wouldn't start a thread complaining about people who have fun in a different way to me... nightclubs are a melting pot of all sorts of people, but they will always attract young, cool people - for they have the most free time and disposable income to spend on entertainment. If you like clubbing but dislike people, you've got to put up with them... just like you have to put up with licensing laws, the occasional wanker of a bouncer and nightbuses.

London is filled with about 8 million people from all different backgrounds and cultures... there are very few places where they're all thrown into the mix together so intimately, but nightclubs are one of them. Whether it's you or the "annoyingly posh" (what does that even mean?!) doing it, it's a sad state of affairs if people are looking around saying "They shouldn't be in here"... raves/clubs are for EVERYONE. Brotherhood of man. I couldn't give a fuck what accent you've got or how much money you earn... on a dancefloor everyone's equal.

But then, I'm just an annoying posh person that likes moshpits, so you can dismiss my opinion and glare at me whilst I'm having fun.

magma wrote: No, I don't, but I also wouldn't start a thread complaining about people who have fun in a different way to me... nightclubs are a melting pot of all sorts of people, but they will always attract young, cool people - for they have the most free time and disposable income to spend on entertainment. If you like clubbing but dislike people, you've got to put up with them... just like you have to put up with licensing laws, the occasional wanker of a bouncer and nightbuses.

London is filled with about 8 million people from all different backgrounds and cultures... there are very few places where they're all thrown into the mix together so intimately, but nightclubs are one of them. Whether it's you or the "annoyingly posh" (what does that even mean?!) doing it, it's a sad state of affairs if people are looking around saying "They shouldn't be in here"... raves/clubs are for EVERYONE. Brotherhood of man. I couldn't give a fuck what accent you've got or how much money you earn... on a dancefloor everyone's equal.

Annoyingly posh means posh people being loud and obnoxious in their loud entitled voices...having no manners in a way unique to their background....they also exhibit incredibl fickle tendencies when it comes to musical choices...displaying huge levels of ignorance towards anyone that appears to be poorer than them (chavs)

I don't care about accent or background either...it's attitude i'm talking about..

the only people i dislike are bandwagon jumpers...they often as you say don't give a shit about the music but are just there to be seen in the right place..

and again as i said THEY don't think everyone should be there themselves...and the irony is the people they look down upon have usually been involved in the scene for a lot longer....really can't imagine a fan of dubstep since it's infancy describing people doing nobody any harm as a chav just because of how they're dressed...

fuck it these people are the reason d&b went the way it did and they will do it to dubstep too

Pistonsbeneath wrote:this is why i said (whatever bad music is)

fun is subjective too...fun is different things to different people...I don't find it fun seeing a load of stupid hat wearing, chortling, cokehead, fickle, painfully posh & loud, jamaican slang using 18 year olds getting in my face lol...this wanker put his drink on the subwoofer ffs...shockingly it fell over and all the coats on it got soaked....he just walked off...he wanted to have fun obviously and look cool...clearly clearing up mess he made wasn't on his agenda...i did it instead glaring at him but he just turned away...this sums up the kind of people I am talking about....this music attracts these types

I don't think I am elitist...certainly not anymore than all the well spoken teenagers complaining of too many 'chavs' being present....HELLO these people you think are 'chavs' invented this music you deluded cretins...fuck off to your klaxons concert and leave decent genres alone....

you think that's unreasonable because it's just based on my experience?

have to say i feel this way when i go out too. you call it elitism if you like, but i do actually miss the days when i used to be able to go out anywhere and listen to anything and still enjoy myself. nowadays i really can't be arsed going out most of the time because i know i'll not enjoy myself. i'd probably have a lot more luck if i could go out in london regularly but it's slim pickings for decent nights here

and again as i said THEY don't think everyone should be there themselves...and the irony is the people they look down upon have usually been involved in the scene for a lot longer....really can't imagine a fan of dubstep since it's infancy describing people doing nobody any harm as a chav just because of how they're dressed...

fuck it these people are the reason d&b went the way it did and they will do it to dubstep too

I agree that it's unpleasant to hear people talking like that... perhaps I just rarely come into contact with it at the clubs I go to, but it seems from this thread that you're doing exactly the same thing... deciding who is and isn't entitled to have an "educated opinion". You managed to raise my hackles by using the word "posh" in a derogatory manner, but the principle still stands - when you walk into a nightclub, you've got to set yourself to "chilled"... it's why my girlfriend doesn't go clubbing, she'd be constantly getting into trouble because of people stepping on her feet or spilling drinks... clubs just aren't her environment, she can't chill out enough to deal with all the people.

Being "involved in the scene" really means nothing either... especially if you don't play out or release tunes. I'm just a punter... I like going to places where you see football shirt wearing "chavs" hugging blokes with fancy haircuts and dayglo sunglasses... it reaffirms my faith in humanity. Yeah, I've followed the Dubstep sound pretty closely for the last few years, but I wouldn't be too upset if there weren't any great Dubstep nights going on... it probably just means that the creativity and community has gone elsewhere - there is ALWAYS interesting EDM out there (as your mixes attest to!).

I think getting protective over individual EDM scenes is always going to be a losing battle... it's picking your club promoters and artists that rewards you, not following a "scene". If you're going to nights where the people/music aren't to your taste, chances are, you're going to the wrong nights... it's time to get back to the research and find somewhere new to go. If your club of choice is filled with people who you don't think scratch the surface for their musical tastes, then perhaps you need to scratch the surface a bit more so that you're more surrounded by likeminded people...

i like this tune... i know i shouldn't but i can't help it, sometimes i just get turned on by ridiculous filth. It aint that intelligent or forward thinking but fuck me it gets me pumped and sometimes thats good enough 2bh.

i still prefer the deep stuff tho, i just enjoy a bit of scum from time to time

Pistonsbeneath wrote:

Luigi wrote:I like the intro, it would be cool if there was a whole tune using just the style of the intro..

try a few hundred made between 91-93

I meant like the actual intro of sweet shop, just it never dropped into the drop it has now, still dubstep but nothing filthy

particle-jim wrote:i just enjoy a bit of scum from time to time

magma wrote: I couldn't give a fuck what accent you've got or how much money you earn... on a dancefloor everyone's equal.

This

Pistonsbeneath wrote: I don't care about accent or background either...it's attitude i'm talking about..

the only people i dislike are bandwagon jumpers...they often as you say don't give a shit about the music but are just there to be seen in the right place..

Really because it sounded like you think 'posh' people are all bandwagon jumpers. I suppose you also think all 'posh' people wear Jack Wills and go yachting as well? Like all working class people are supposedly on the dole and go on Jeremy Kyle?

haha I think i've come across as a bit of a twat on here

It's hard to convey my thoughts here...

I have friends from all backgrounds....it's not really about where people come from but certain behavioural attributes that one associates with (some) people from a certain group...

I actually would say i have an exceptional ability to communicate with people from all backgrounds...I can have a chat with a customer at work about grime and get them to buy terrah danjahs new record AS WELL AS being able to talk about duke ellington or vashti bunyan or bela bartok...my family moved me in posh circles as a kid but now I move in different circles and live on a grotty estate....I feel superior I guess than 1 dimensional people

I along with many people helped collectively to push dubstep to a bigger audience..be it via promotion (no one came then and these same people probably wouldnt have been interested due to it not being well known enough) or via ordering it in and selling it from my job...not to mention playing it to mates that again werent interested but now love al the brostep flavours....these people I feel are repulsive the way they roll up as soon as it's in and talk about it as if it's theirs and they know it and that's just how i feel...

I suppose I feel like have bee forced into this way of thinking on this subject by people pushing my buttons...why couldn't dubstep stay as good as it was or rather not get shitty and divided into dumbed down bruk owt and kinda po faced dark drug music instead of all being 1 unified YET diverse sound?

marlow - scum is right...that's a sensational tune...why didn't loads off peopl bruk owt to that?

Pistonsbeneath wrote:I suppose I feel like have bee forced into this way of thinking on this subject by people pushing my buttons...why couldn't dubstep stay as good as it was or rather not get shitty and divided into dumbed down bruk owt and kinda po faced dark drug music instead of all being 1 unified YET diverse sound?

This happens to everything over time.... as time progresses more people hear about it and so you end up with an audience that could fill somewhere like Mass, Plastic People or The End (or whatever it's called this week) five times over... when that happens, you need enough acts to support 3 or 4 major clubnights per weekend, so the nights get more specialised and the crowds get split up.

I've always found my favourite EDM nights aren't strict genre-nights anyway... my favourite club in London (as you might have noticed) is Bangface because I can roll up and listen to oldskool hardcore, idm, breakcore, dubstep, DnB, jungle, electro, house etc all under one roof... the crowd is great because everyone turned up for a party with a great soundtrack.

Genres will always disappoint in the end... I used to get upset about hiphop; it's probably the biggest love of my life and I used to get into proper arguments about sellouts and stuff... I found I walked around with a smile a bit more often after I decided to just listen to what I liked and not pay attention to the rest of it. It's surprising how easy it is to avoid bad music*!


*maybe not if you work in HMV.

Peace and love as always, but you knew that

Some sounds have run there course in this scene, others are just starting.. Its all good i say.

-dubson- wrote:Some sounds have run there course in this scene, others are just starting.. Its all good i say.

oh yeah it's fantastic that the good stuff is gone...how exactly does a sound run it's course anyway?

Pistonsbeneath wrote:

-dubson- wrote:Some sounds have run there course in this scene, others are just starting.. Its all good i say.

oh yeah it's fantastic that the good stuff is gone...how exactly does a sound run it's course anyway?

It gets stale, repeats itself, lacks the inspiration to move forward. Dubstep can't just keep having Mud or Request Line or Anti War Dub style tunes being made forever can it?

If you think all the good stuff is gone then i don't see that as dubsteps problem, i dont mean that in a offensive way. I just mean things evolve.

looks like it's got pretty deep in here will give a read later

I still think its a good tune but in just a couple of days since my last post its appeal has faded. Dubstep wise I do prefer the atmospheric sub bass style of say Cyrus or the stuff Bunzer0 plays and I found myself listening to Sweet Shop last night thinking 'where the fuck is the sub bass?'...

-dubson- wrote:

Pistonsbeneath wrote:

-dubson- wrote:Some sounds have run there course in this scene, others are just starting.. Its all good i say.

oh yeah it's fantastic that the good stuff is gone...how exactly does a sound run it's course anyway?

It gets stale, repeats itself, lacks the inspiration to move forward. Dubstep can't just keep having Mud or Request Line or Anti War Dub style tunes being made forever can it?

If you think all the good stuff is gone then i don't see that as dubsteps problem, i dont mean that in a offensive way. I just mean things evolve.

I was just being sarcastic you know?

there is still good dubstep...where did i say there wasn't?

I specifically don't get why the rubbish is so prevalent an such genius is ignored...I don't want to listen to mrl and awd for ever ffs....

I think it's a shame that people had to take the most obvious elements of wobbley bass music and just focus on those elements and nothing else....

the untold remix of the knowledge has wobbles in it but it's fucking amazing...

I've seen you delivering this argument a million times and it never get's any more true lol

please explain how evolving involved going backwards?

this genre began as an antidote to the shit and now the shit has merged with the genre....this is going backwards rather than forwards therefore it's not evolution...

I think you'll find loefah would agree with me btw...as would kode9 & burial

Ok ok, i didnt get the sarcasm. Its not exactly like you dont hear people saying all dubstep is shit nowadays...

The sound splitting up and evolving doesnt mean the music will get better, it will change. Hype tunes will get more recognition cos they are gonna send a club of ravers mental. The mainstream popularity of the scene is gonna be ravey wobble tunes, with a few exceptions. Not saying thats right but its true at the moment.

Same way jungle turned into rave rewind music and garage turned into pop. This happens again and again! Theres enough good dubstep round to stop the scene totally going to shit. Its all cycles, there will probably be a antidote to dubstep once the time is right.

The problem we have with 'sweet shop' is that it is 'throwaway music'. surely no-one thinks that this tune will stand the test of time? as with most music these days it is out there for maybe 3 months, max, before it is never played again. i'm sure that none of us will be digging this tune out in ten years time and going 'fuck me this stuff was good' (and i know that most of us will pick up something from 92-95 and easily say that). what makes this tune stand out is its intro. sure the drop is good and it provokes a reaction but its nothing that we havent heard before and would be so starkly different if it were not for the intro. and what is the intro? a rave tune fro the early 90's. i rest my case.
Just in case i have some non believers here i have it on good authority that the sample is from a tune by 'Rhythm Section' (Ellis Dee & Rennie Pilgrem). Even though Doctor P is denying it himself.

doctor_p wrote:

norman swashbuckle wrote:dubstep is dead, wobble wobble wobble

i like the tune he sampled though

its not actually a sample and im not gonna get into a discussion about dubstep bein dead with sum1 who posts on dubstep forum lol

big ups on all the possitive comments though!!! should be out just before or after xmas if all goes to plan!

Didn't realise there was a post made in here about this tune but i'm glad i've found it.

I've had to leave the dancefloor everytime this tune is played since December if I remember correctly.

My take on this tune is pretty much with accordance with most people here, very disposable and has a very annoying drop. I can see why the kids go nuts to it has the more higher pitched synths get the crazier the brukout but every time it gets dropped I find myself rolling my eyes and walking away.

Thankfully Sweetshop hasn't made me lose faith in Dubstep yet, Pangaea's new EP fixed that.