Dubstepforum.com

Posted: **Mon Jul 13, 2009 6:50 pm**

Sifres wrote: Point is the industry has done nothing but try to squeeze the people out of their cash.

what industry are you talking about? dubstep isn't an industry!! it BARELY and i mean BARELY supports itself on sales only. this is fact! the "recording industry" and RIAA, doesn't support or have anything to do with this sound. that "RIAA" excuse just doesn't have any ground to stand on in regards to underground music. everytime you download and share signed tracks, some label or producer loses. its not helping them promote or spread their sound. in 2009 with google/myspace/facebook/blogs...there's no excuses you can make about the benefit of p2p promo. music is easily found, without the help of you sharing it on your drive.

the P2P attitude is basically a big FUCK you to any grassroots community like this one. if you support filesharing then don't think that it gives you the right to piss all over the rights of other people that want to stand up against it.

Posted: **Mon Jul 13, 2009 6:50 pm**

classic sampling done right

Posted: **Mon Jul 13, 2009 6:50 pm**

Sifres wrote:
bass hertz wrote:nothing says I love my wife more than sharing her with all my friends.

really... I'm promoting women.
yeah mate... valid... argument... But I get it... You're angry... Just saying there is a good side to it too...

Point is the industry has done nothing but try to squeeze the people out of their cash.

Let me finish my mixtape point to illustrate this. In holland we have an organisation called BUMA STEMRA, they represent the combined artists. Similar to the RIAA I guess.

They can send you a takedown notice for putting your own music on your website. Sad but true. They will, and are capable doing so by law. They will come down 3x as hard if it is a site hosting mixtapes that are not originaly from the DJ himself. So any effort hosting a mixtape site in Holland is pointless.

So yes... It is piracy. Legaly that is. The point that everybody (even the dj's themselves) think it's alright doesn't change that.

Keep in mind also you are generating money for Soundcloud, Megaupload, Rapidshare etc,

Then in holland you have the SENA. They are a sister organisation to the BUMA. They are the ones that charge discotheques and DJ's. They will even charge livesets. Hosting a 2000 people free rave in a legal location, will result in a 3000 euro bill. Even if you prove that it was 100% bands and liveacts. I have seen people getting in serious debts over this.

This is all good you say? Money flows to the artists? Yeah... If your music is played on the radio and is from sony/virgin it is. But these people charge by the track, regardless if you are affiliated. Money get's devided because at a couple of bars they will have listening computers stationed, so they can spot trends...

Lone Dubstep DJ get's paid? Nah... But get's charged for playing his own tracks.

These people also lost about 400mln euro's because of bad investments.

FUCK the industry. I will buy from independant labels but I have no problem downloading the latest Eminem album. NONE...

i know I am wasting my time.

We are talking apples and oranges, and your talking apples and helicopters.

we are talking about something EXTREMELY simple.

do you have the right to steal other peoples works?!??

It don't matter who owns it... artists, labels, radio stations, promotion companies, magazine, sizan, the government, secret societies trying to take down the world, or even satans new fucking bluegrass album.

theft is theft.

Posted: **Mon Jul 13, 2009 6:53 pm**

"note the subtle gunfinger"

Posted: **Mon Jul 13, 2009 6:54 pm**

do i have the right to try on other people's works, wear them around the store for a bit & put them back if i don't like them? Now i'm not just talking about trying on the shoelaces, but the whole shoe. i might even show em off to a friend or two if they are around. Can't take em around the block but as long as you are on your computer, listening to things you've never heard, maybe even showing em off to a friend or two, then its pretty fair to be able to try on as many as you want before making your final decision, yes? might even go back & try em on a second or third time before laying down some monies...wait...was this about dubstep or shoes again?

Posted: **Mon Jul 13, 2009 6:57 pm**

dubstep not shoes

Posted: **Mon Jul 13, 2009 6:57 pm**

downloadable shelltoes. fucking brilliant.

and the theory still applies, yes?

Posted: **Mon Jul 13, 2009 7:01 pm**

Alot of people follow the logic that leeching music for free supports the artists live events (where they make the real money).

what does leeching movies do?? Support the movie industry by people going to see the same movie, again, in a theatre??

Posted: **Mon Jul 13, 2009 7:10 pm**

live events alone cannot support a musician...unless they have already established a following to generate revenue at the show. more than half the vinyls ive purchased i heard shared first. I live in bumfuck yoh, lol...

and mainstream movies, ie. Miramar, etc...they can fuck off. i have a stack of burned movies that i've watched once & would never want to again...when the stack gets big enough they all get tossed. Mean while in the time that takes, i'll have another stack of purchased dvds that i'll watch 100 times before i die. Fellini, Brunel, The Quay Brothers, Miyazaki, Adult Swim, Tim Burton...these are things i have supported with my money, and much more. You know that movie Holes? yeh...that got tossed, lol...

If it were not for torrents i nor anyone else would have Sifl & Olly on DVD. It doesnt exist, and when MTV makes it I'll buy 10 to give to friends. Until then i thank all the gods for the guy that videotaped it & uploaded it! cheers...

Posted: **Mon Jul 13, 2009 7:16 pm**

seckle wrote:
Sifres wrote: Point is the industry has done nothing but try to squeeze the people out of their cash.
what industry are you talking about? dubstep isn't an industry!! it BARELY and i mean BARELY supports itself on sales only. this is fact! the "recording industry" and RIAA, doesn't support or have anything to do this sound. that "RIAA" "The industry" excuse just doesn't have any ground to stand on in regards to underground music. everytime you download and share signed tracks, some label or producer loses. its not helping them promote or spread their sound. in 2009 with google/myspace/facebook/blogs...there's no excuses you can make about the benefit of p2p promo. music is easily found, without the help of you sharing it on your drive.

the P2P attitude is basically a big FUCK you to any grassroots community like this one. if you support filesharing then don't think that it gives you the right to piss all over the rights of other people that want to stand up against it.

Props for reading my first post mate;

That being said. I DO buy my music. The non commercial stuff anyway. And definitely the stuff I spin @ clubs. I am happy with sites that make cash flow directly to the artist and the ease with wich you can start a net label. That's the real revolution...

As said. I have no trouble supporting artist. Be it by going to a gig or buying music. I BUY my dubstep. And before this I bought my electro, and before that I bought my acid tekno.

I do, however, have problems with corporate fucks squeezing money out of it, just because they can. Pop charts being invented to sell music. Or did you think that those really are the songs that everybody buys? Wrong. It's the ones they want to get sold.

Understand I am talking about the music industry. MTV stuff. Not Excisions new release.

Have you ever tried to get a hold of 320 dubstep on p2p, apart from Skream & Rusko maybe? Just not on there mate. Not unless you look harder. Wich 90% aren't capable of.

If your records aren't making sales in the dubstep community, it's not because people are pirating it. It's because they aren't selling. And if it IS being pirated, you're already making sales and performing. And making money of it.

Posted: **Mon Jul 13, 2009 7:18 pm**

Adikt wrote:

If it were not for torrents i nor anyone else would have Sifl & Olly on DVD. It doesnt exist, and when MTV makes it I'll buy 10 to give to friends. Until then i thank all the gods for the guy that videotaped it & uploaded it! cheers...

well, get your check book out:

http://www.amazon.com/Sifl-Olly-Season- ... 823&sr=1-1

hmm... it's been released sinnce 2005.

you can get on amazon.com in Gainsville, FL cant you?

oh and it's $140.00
x10 people
that's only gonna set you back $1400.00
lol

Posted: **Mon Jul 13, 2009 7:27 pm**

Sifres wrote:it's not because people are pirating it. It's because they aren't selling.

show me some proof of that, or it means nothing.

maybe 15% of the top names in this scene do fly around the world touring and getting paid. do they get any money off their own tunes being bought and sold? barely. nothing to talk about. maybe a few hundred at the most, and that would be for a huge tune.

everyone else thats selling tunes in download stores, is making zero, the moment they get shared. how do you feel about those people, or do you apply your thinking to the top names, and everyone else is just out of luck. what about the next guy about to be huge, thats paid for his studio and software, and put in the work. he's put his first tunes on a download store? does he get the same justifications?

Posted: **Mon Jul 13, 2009 7:30 pm**

first of all...not everyone can fucking click on every link on the internet. I'm not going to search the entire archive site every single time i have a conversation on a forum & I'm not going to be up to date on everything that comes out, even if i do want it. I do to much & find too much out to guess what is gonna pop up in a discussion and know it ahead of time. I do thank you for the link to the Lost Episodes, but i was referring to the actual show that was aired. Thats what i have. I do not have the lost episodes & will likely purchase it very soon. The show on Amazon says to sign up to find out when it will be available...which it has said for years

and by boondocks i mean that no one here is gonna be showing me their dubstep collection or introducing me to new Eastern European Dub artists(which are apparently the shit)...heh...Octave Noize is yet another example of my downloading & then me & a friend buying the EP...

Posted: **Mon Jul 13, 2009 7:32 pm**

seckle wrote:
Sifres wrote:it's not because people are pirating it. It's because they aren't selling.
show me some proof of that, or it means nothing.

maybe 15% of the top names in this scene do fly around the world touring and getting paid. do they get any money off their own tunes being bought and sold? barely. nothing to talk about. maybe a few hundred at the most, and that would be for a huge tune.

everyone else thats selling tunes in download stores, is making zero, the moment they get shared. how do you feel about those people, or do you apply your thinking to the top names, and everyone else is just out of luck. what about the next guy about to be huge, thats paid for his studio and software, and put in the work. he's put his first tunes on a download store? does he get the same justifications?

Me and your are on the same page mate. Good to see someone get the big picture. I really think it boils down to people thinking about others and not themselves.

"heh... that homeless guy at the intersection... he's only got like 73 cents in his cup... shit.. he really gets his food at the shelter, so that's what really counts to him... I think I'll run over there and snatch his 73 cents"

Posted: **Mon Jul 13, 2009 7:33 pm**

seckle wrote:what about the next guy

if he's good he should be supported & if he's not good he shouldn't be.
less crappy art & more money for the talented ones...

and apparently thats a really naive thought these days...

Posted: **Mon Jul 13, 2009 7:36 pm**

Adikt wrote: and by boondocks i mean that no one here is gonna be showing me their dubstep collection or introducing me to new Eastern European Dub artists(which are apparently the shit)...heh...Octave Noize is yet another example of my downloading & then me & a friend buying the EP...

ummm... yea... um. uh..

sure man.

just dont spread the ep

I think I'm done with this now.

Posted: **Mon Jul 13, 2009 7:39 pm**

Adikt wrote:
seckle wrote:what about the next guy
if he's good he should be supported & if he's not good he shouldn't be.
less crappy art & more money for the talented ones...

and apparently thats a really naive thought these days...

That isn't the way it works. Chase & Status are the most talented dubstep artists? More money for them? Less money for the artists that are not trying to just put out tunes with the latest Massive presets and actually putting their heart and soul into the music? Fuck that.

Posted: **Mon Jul 13, 2009 7:41 pm**

I didnt realize people went to p2p's to be exposed to new artists like that

surely the blogosphere is a decent 1st stop?

mixtapes.de is a sweet spot for music, kinda got me started on all number of amazing stuff way back when

its just the wrong place for this discussion, the wrong scene to find some middle ground on piracy, bottom line is there's zero tolerance and I think thats a good thing

stalwart holdouts your time

Posted: **Mon Jul 13, 2009 7:44 pm**

the thing thats incredible about the P2P thinking is this selfish indulgence. my mp3 collection...my hard drives....my movies...my right to download what i want.

pay for the art you consume. we don't live in the fucking stone age.

Posted: **Mon Jul 13, 2009 7:46 pm**

about the Chase & Status thing...no...thats kind of backwards...cus the REAL artists you mention would be the ones being supported...perhaps by Chase & Status

ok, so...a thought...not an argument so much as a thought...

ok...so follow me here...i'm not so much talking about us anymore...say that everyone in the world suddenly decided to stop buying anything because it was popular & only purchase because its GOOD. Now thats a broad word for humanity so this would be used as a pretty broad term. For about 20 years it would suck even more for the small guy but after 20 years of no one paying attention to MTV, do you think anyone is gonna give a damn about Fall Out Boy or Kanye anymore or will the focus have gone to the real music...the real music in every genre that anyone likes. With that attention on the real music comes the money. Now we have people supporting artists rather than corporations. i personally am willing to take that fall & give my music away so that people may learn to enjoy without prior knowledge of financial popularity. thats the bigger picture, at least in my head. And when it comes to dubstep i would think that most of the people involved are so damn grimey that it could be one of the first real underground genres that pushes thru that established notion of money = better music. sorry if i kind of got distracted from file sharing...the conversation interests me

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