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US Presidential Election '08
Posted: Sun Nov 12, 2006 8:54 pm
by mos dan
Inspired by Seckle's sig (who are Stewart and Cobolt (sic)?)
The bigger, more obvious q's to me seem to be:
*Will it be Hillary for the Dems?
*Can anyone best her in the primaries?
*Can she beat McCain/Condi/the other big GOP names?
*Will it be McCain/Condi/Guiliani/someone else?
A lot of those are being discussed on this side of the pond, and are up for debate here obv, but what I would reeeeally like to know, is who the Americans on here think might win for the Dems on a genuinely radical ticket, and how?
*Is it Obama's time? Will it ever be his time?
*Is there anyone Howard Dean-like who I don't know about? I loved that guy last time around - he had some dubiously reactionary views but his energy and grassroots 'ordinary Americans' shtick was a breath of fresh air IMHO.
*Who's your ideal ticket to face the Republicans in 08?
Sorry to ask so many q's, I'm still ill (thus bored) plus I totally heart US politics for some reason.
Re: US Presidential Election '08
Posted: Sun Nov 12, 2006 9:12 pm
by seckle
mos dan wrote:Inspired by Seckle's sig (who are Stewart and Cobolt (sic)?)
The bigger, more obvious q's to me seem to be:
*Will it be Hillary for the Dems?
*Can anyone best her in the primaries?
*Can she beat McCain/Condi/the other big GOP names?
*Will it be McCain/Condi/Guiliani/someone else?
A lot of those are being discussed on this side of the pond, and are up for debate here obv, but what I would reeeeally like to know, is who the Americans on here think might win for the Dems on a genuinely radical ticket, and how?
*Is it Obama's time? Will it ever be his time?
*Is there anyone Howard Dean-like who I don't know about? I loved that guy last time around - he had some dubiously reactionary views but his energy and grassroots 'ordinary Americans' shtick was a breath of fresh air IMHO.
*Who's your ideal ticket to face the Republicans in 08?
Sorry to ask so many q's, I'm still ill (thus bored) plus I totally heart US politics for some reason.
stewart and colbert are comedians that run a highly left wing democratic show on TV here in america. they've perfected highly intelligent political sarcasm, and in the last 6 months they've doubled their viewing audience, by blasting the republicans every night , 5 nights a week. my sig is just a little joke really.
http://www.cafepress.com/buy/stewart+co ... P=KNC-G-EF
http://www.comedycentral.com/shows/the_ ... ndex.jhtml
it's still very early to say which one of our dem candidates will have the strategy and platform to pull off a bid to run in 2008. obama or hillary would be interesting. obama is gaining ground everyday. american voters have always loved dynastic politics (kennedy's, bush's), so i wouldn't be surprised if hillary's campaign gains big momentum quickly. a female president would be groundbreaking to say the least.
Re: US Presidential Election '08
Posted: Sun Nov 12, 2006 10:50 pm
by rickyricardo
mos dan wrote:*Will it be Hillary for the Dems?
God let's hope not....
*Can anyone best her in the primaries?
God let's hope so....
*Can she beat McCain/Condi/the other big GOP names?
No...which is why I hope she doesn't take the nomination. Btw, I really don't see Condi making a run. It's highly unusual for someone who's never held an elected office before to just suddenly decide to run for president.....moreover, someone who has been rather ineffectual in the offices she *has* held. I think the GOP just wants Condi b/c they think she can put the minority double-whammy over on Hillary.
My money is on Guiliani taking the Repub. nomination, with maybe McCain as running mate. Depending on what the primaries say...it will either be Hillary or Joe Biden for the Dems. Obama is too green right now...maybe he'll get picked up as a running mate, but I just don't see him securing a nomination.
but what I would reeeeally like to know, is who the Americans on here think might win for the Dems on a genuinely radical ticket, and how?
No one. The Dems aren't going to support a radical candidate, with radical ideas (see Kucinich). See, the thing to understand is, the Dems didn't win this last midterm by bringing people to the left on the potency of their ideas....they won by moving more to the right, and using Bush's fuckups against him. On some issues (like immigration), you saw the Dems falling all over themselves to be even more right-wing than the President. This is why people like Hillary or Lieberman piss me off so much....it's b/c despite being in the "liberal" party, alot of them are just acting the role of "Republican-lite", in order to shave off the more center-right voters disillusioned w/ the GOP. The problem is that in doing this they just move the political establishment as a whole more to the right, and make the distinctions between the two parties even more laughable than they were already.
*Who's your ideal ticket to face the Republicans in 08?
Marx/Engels '08
Re: US Presidential Election '08
Posted: Sun Nov 12, 2006 11:05 pm
by seckle
RickyRicardo wrote:mos dan wrote:
*Who's your ideal ticket to face the Republicans in 08?
Marx/Engels '08
LOL.
i agree with you on the radical candidate thing. traditionally, the success rate for any radical candidate from either party is very very slim. america doesn't deal with abrupt changes very well. you tend to see middle of the road candidates from either party getting through, more than people with a hard on for issues that may be viewed in the past as controversial/extreme ( same sex marriage, roe vs wade, stem cell research, treehugging environmentalism, etc). kennedy, carter and clinton; the last three elected democratic presidents, all ran middle of the road campaigns.
Posted: Mon Nov 13, 2006 12:32 am
by marsyas
obama...for real.
Re: US Presidential Election '08
Posted: Mon Nov 13, 2006 1:21 am
by echo wanderer
mos dan wrote:Inspired by Seckle's sig
I was feelin' that too.Only in a fantasy world could it happen,but the world would be an awesome place!
Posted: Mon Nov 13, 2006 1:21 am
by echo wanderer
Marsyas wrote:obama...for real.
Hell yeah!
Re: US Presidential Election '08
Posted: Mon Nov 13, 2006 2:31 am
by echo wanderer
RickyRicardo wrote:mos dan wrote:*Will it be Hillary for the Dems?
God let's hope not....
I doubt it.Especially not after Bill.Another reason below.
mos dan wrote:*Can anyone best her in the primaries?
God let's hope so....
Obama.Definitely.Edwards(due in part to his wife)could pull in the domestic vote with a "good,wholesome,family values-filled" image.I am afraid of Daschel,but even he could possibly do it.I doubt any will get picked though.Most likely it'll be Biden.
mos dan wrote:*Can she beat McCain/Condi/the other big GOP names?
No...which is why I hope she doesn't take the nomination. Btw, I really don't see Condi making a run. It's highly unusual for someone who's never held an elected office before to just suddenly decide to run for president.....moreover, someone who has been rather ineffectual in the offices she *has* held. I think the GOP just wants Condi b/c they think she can put the minority double-whammy over on Hillary.
My money is on Guiliani taking the Repub. nomination, with maybe McCain as running mate. Depending on what the primaries say...it will either be Hillary or Joe Biden for the Dems. Obama is too green right now...maybe he'll get picked up as a running mate, but I just don't see him securing a nomination.
Agreed.Condi sucks,but she is a lot smarter than Billary.America isn't ready for a woman president.Even more so,America is neither ready or will accept a black president.And I think we're pretty tired of blatant liars,and she knows that she's helped lead the American people to some really bad times.Who knows?Maybe she will go the way of Powell,realise how many atrocities she is responisble for,and resign so she can go public about it.But,the "minority double-whammy"(love it!VERY clever!
) is something that she seems to have worked very hard to stay away from.Which is the main reason why Powell wouldn't run on Bush Sr.'s suggestion.True,Obama might be too grassroots,but race is still a much bigger factor.I don't think he'll even get picked as a running mate because of it.What Powell realised and what Condi will soon realise is that they are "token".Both came into power in the 90's,when "politcal correctness" and "affirmitive action" were household words.Especially in the White House.Jesse Jackson never had a shot,and it was good he tried,but he gave black politicians a bad name in the process(mostly due to lack of political experience).
It's been said before,and I'll say it again:Clinton was about the closest to a black president we'll ever get.
mos dan wrote:but what I would reeeeally like to know, is who the Americans on here think might win for the Dems on a genuinely radical ticket, and how?
No one. The Dems aren't going to support a radical candidate, with radical ideas (see Kucinich). See, the thing to understand is, the Dems didn't win this last midterm by bringing people to the left on the potency of their ideas....they won by moving more to the right, and using Bush's fuckups against him. On some issues (like immigration), you saw the Dems falling all over themselves to be even more right-wing than the President. This is why people like Hillary or Lieberman piss me off so much....it's b/c despite being in the "liberal" party, alot of them are just acting the role of "Republican-lite", in order to shave off the more center-right voters disillusioned w/ the GOP. The problem is that in doing this they just move the political establishment as a whole more to the right, and make the distinctions between the two parties even more laughable than they were already.
HAHAHA!Dude,you are wicked smart and funny!"Shave off the center-right".Billary is a "closet-con".Always was,always will be.When the Monica Lewinski cocksucking incident happened,she was out there on the talkshows,interviews,and magazines going off about "how she stands by her man",but when it came time to answer questions about Whitewater or the Serb-Croatian war,she was quiet...and made sure Bill was too.She definitely knows the game,yes,but the problem is,that she plays it too.I bet she and Laura Bush go for tea.And possibly lesbian sex...(Hillary's the "man")
mos dan wrote:*Who's your ideal ticket to face the Republicans in 08?
Marx/Engels '08
Dalai Lama/Gurdjieff '08
Posted: Mon Nov 13, 2006 3:41 pm
by afincham83
if hillary runs, the only way to be beat her wil be with another woman. lets be honest american women will vote for her just bc she is woman. republican/dem/or whatever they will vote for her based upon her sex. so the only opposition she may have is the experienced condi rice. she wont win just bc she is black. dont underestimate the racist feelings of whites still in america. it still comes down to...it really doesnt matter bc they are working for the same people...the corporations.
Posted: Mon Nov 13, 2006 4:27 pm
by rickyricardo
afincham83 wrote:if hillary runs, the only way to be beat her wil be with another woman. lets be honest american women will vote for her just bc she is woman.
I'd disagree with that. If women voters were that one-dimensional, they would have pushed Walter Mondale/Geraldine Ferraro into the presidency in '84, or at least gave them a fighting chance. Instead, they were crushed in virtually every state.
so the only opposition she may have is the experienced condi rice. she wont win just bc she is black. dont underestimate the racist feelings of whites still in america.
I don't necessarily agree w/ that either. If the option came down to Condi or another Clinton (which I don't think it will..but hypothetically), traditional GOP voters are just going to keep voting w/ their party, rather than vote against their interests b/c of racial prejudice.
In most respects, issues trump race. For example, look at what happened w/ the last senate race for Maryland. A prominent black GOP candidate could barely even muster a quarter of the votes in the majority black Prince Georges County. In fact he only came out on top in counties that traditionally voted Republican and had a white majorities. People aren't going to blindly vote against their interests, just b/c a candidate does or doesn't look like them.
Posted: Tue Nov 14, 2006 8:40 pm
by mos dan
very interesting stuff, safe! can anyone give me a brief briefing on joe biden? i could just google him obv but interested to hear your views.
yeah now you mention it john stewart is on british tv as well now on a daily basis - great that there's someone like him to counterbalance the *insert unbelivably strong expletive here* people on fox news.
anyone ever listen to air america radio? i've tuned in a couple of times. the humour's overdone at times tho i feel.
isn't it the case that giuliani/mccain would be an incredibly strong ticket? they're both such strong characters, which was more than could be said for bush/cheney.
Posted: Tue Nov 14, 2006 9:08 pm
by rickyricardo
mos dan wrote:can anyone give me a brief briefing on joe biden?
He's a twat.
Posted: Tue Nov 14, 2006 10:13 pm
by joenicedj
there's only one man for the job.....
ME.
It's the DubWar party. Forget democrats and republicans. No bi-partizan leadership here.
DaveQ - VP.
Juakali - Sec. of State.
Our slogan: "Things won't necessarily be better, but things will be different."
Look for us on your ballot.....we're coming!
Posted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 5:41 am
by echo wanderer
RickyRicardo wrote:mos dan wrote:can anyone give me a brief briefing on joe biden?
He's a twat.
heh heh heh....
Posted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 5:43 am
by echo wanderer
joenice wrote:there's only one man for the job.....
ME.
It's the DubWar party. Forget democrats and republicans. No bi-partizan leadership here.
DaveQ - VP.
Juakali - Sec. of State.
Our slogan: "Things won't necessarily be better, but things will be different."
Look for us on your ballot.....we're coming!
You got this dubber's vote!