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New to the ds production forum, so hi all.

Recently started getting involved on production and that kind of tip, I've messed about with reason on and off for years but never really given it enough attention... sadly. Been mixing for a while so familiar with structure etc etc.

Anyways, to my question... I've checked on the noob thread and there wasn't any info, so I guess I'm being dumb, but I'm having real problems coming up with riffs, leads and that kind of thing- I have no real musical knowledge in terms of instruments- I know a lot of people who produce that are in the same boat, but they all seem to able to come up with something... just feel like I'm hitting a big brick wall at this part, and I know this is obviously where the creativity comes in. I have melodies in my head, but can never seem to play them out on the keyboard...

Any help/ advice/ suggestions would be appreciated.

Cheers.

did u read up on scales cuz they help. try a arp? watch the benga master class?

not everybody was meant to make music, and nobody can teach you how to write a melody.

listen to music. not dubstep, something else. how is the melody put together, how does it relate to the other elements?

feel it. if you don't feel it, well...

Recessive Trait wrote:not everybody was meant to make music, and nobody can teach you how to write a melody.

listen to music. not dubstep, something else. how is the melody put together, how does it relate to the other elements?

feel it. if you don't feel it, well...

well then keep trying till u do as long as its fun. once u cant do it and its not fun then give up mate

I don't want to be taught how to come up with a melody, if I couldn't think up melodies then I'd give up straight away lol- I can come up with them in my head all day long, it's just I can't transfer the melody from my head to the keyboard as I have no real knowledge of keyboards/ instruments/ scales/ chords etc...

I think the scales thing is definitely something I need to have a good read of.

cheers.

tripwire22 wrote:did u read up on scales cuz they help. try a arp? watch the benga master class?

What is a arp?

An arp is an arpeggiator (no clue on the spelling). Kind of you program a melody into a synth and it plays it whenever you press a key.

The demotivional postings here aside I feel with you. I have no clue about music theory, chords, scales yadda yadda and I have a hard time coming up with melodies longer than 1 bar really. Still, I have my MIDI keyboard and sometimes I just press more or less random keys on it. You slowly (and I mean slowly) will notice which keys followed by other keys sound good or bad and you start to get the hang of it. I still can't play anywhere near my mate who's been taking lessons for years I think.

I take it you know if something sounds nice or not, so just keep playing on the keyboard. I'm thinking about taking keyboard lessons and if you are serious, so should you. Or get some books (sorry, I don't know of any) and teach the damn shit yourself.
Most of all - don't give up as suggested, unless you made a serious effort you can't say making music is nothing for you. You obviously have melodies in your head so the transfer from head to MIDI notes fails just as it does for me. This can be learned!

hard to explain but basic like putting notes up down scale. Like c d# g d# c or some daws and synths have a arpeggiortor I'm spelling it so wrong but it will change up ur notes from ur chords or totally arrange ur chords in some quick melody

iambullet wrote:An arp is an arpeggiator (no clue on the spelling). Kind of you program a melody into a synth and it plays it whenever you press a key.

The demotivional postings here aside I feel with you. I have no clue about music theory, chords, scales yadda yadda and I have a hard time coming up with melodies longer than 1 bar really. Still, I have my MIDI keyboard and sometimes I just press more or less random keys on it. You slowly (and I mean slowly) will notice which keys followed by other keys sound good or bad and you start to get the hang of it. I still can't play anywhere near my mate who's been taking lessons for years I think.

I take it you know if something sounds nice or not, so just keep playing on the keyboard. I'm thinking about taking keyboard lessons and if you are serious, so should you. Or get some books (sorry, I don't know of any) and teach the damn shit yourself.
Most of all - don't give up as suggested, unless you made a serious effort you can't say making music is nothing for you. You obviously have melodies in your head so the transfer from head to MIDI notes fails just as it does for me. This can be learned!

Wouldn't consider giving it up for one second! Plenty of good resources out there so no doubt I'll invest in keyboard lessons/ watch a few hours worth of stuff on youtube or whatever it takes.

Hey there ! Ever tried a chromatic tuner? I use it once in a while (even if I'm studying music at college), I sing the notes and fill in the blanks for my melody. What it does it gives you the note that something is playing. I use it to tune my harpsichord, play a note or sing it and it says ... like A or B or whatever note you sang and if the note is okay and well tuned. Give it a try !

Thanks for the responses guys... big ups.

If you got enough sparetime, would a great idea be to start out getting private lessons by some pianist. I played piano in like 2 years and i really feel that it helped me alot.
If you're too poor or just lazy, i would start out listening to some other melodic genres. Hear how the melodies are constructed and try to make them yourself. After you've made a couple of melodies each day in a longer period, you should be able to feel a positive development.

The answer is pretty self-apparent... at least to me.

START PLAYING A FUCKIN' INSTRUMENT.

You won't ever learn to translate the melodies in your head into any medium unless you actually start playing melodies. As Abiotic says, you can't go wrong with piano classes, and many communities have free piano classes at community centers and colleges and whatnot. Youtube even has a shitload of "how to play piano in 10 easy lessons" type videos. Musical proficiency is one of those things there's no shortcut for - you get out of it what you put into it, meaning hours of practice and play. The guy who spends an hour a day playing piano (or any instrument) for ten years is still not going to be as good as the guy who's spent just 3 years playing 8 hours a day.

The good news though? It's fun. No, really. And chicks like dudes that can play instruments, so double plus bonus there.

I personally guarantee that if you took just one keyboard class with a decent teacher, you'd INSTANTLY see results.

I used to play the guitar and now have a basic understand of keyboard melodies through my MIDI controller. Lately though, i'll work out a scale/group of notes that i like and work out a basic pattern that i like on my controller. Then i'll open up the piano roll and draw in the notes that i like in a similiar pattern, but it'll always come out different. Got sound real interesting lead patterns that i'd never have thought to play this way.

eh just keep trying to write them over and over again and eventually you'll get it

that's really it. it'll probably be shit at first, but it doesn't matter. your ears will get more accustomed to your working methods and you'll get faster and faster at it. Read up on theory or take an instrument up if you like. They might help you get around it faster, but they'll also influence your work in a different way... really not all that obligatory.

"not everyone is cut out to be a musician" is a bit misleading... really the only things that can stop you are a complete lack of interest, being tone deaf (in which case you probably aren't interested anyway), or paralysis/death. just go out there and make make make make

Recessive Trait wrote:not everybody was meant to make music, and nobody can teach you how to write a melody.

listen to music. not dubstep, something else. how is the melody put together, how does it relate to the other elements?

feel it. if you don't feel it, well...

this is a highly ignorant comment and should be ignored

Search 'melody lines' there's a crap load of threads come up on page 1 that are helpful.

decree wrote:

Recessive Trait wrote:not everybody was meant to make music, and nobody can teach you how to write a melody.

listen to music. not dubstep, something else. how is the melody put together, how does it relate to the other elements?

feel it. if you don't feel it, well...

this is a highly ignorant comment and should be ignored

Agreed. You can be taught how to write a melody. Fact of the matter is just by hearing music you gain an understanding of how music sounds and the sounds that you yourself enjoy. You know what the sound is that you want to make, problem is your brain doesn't know how to transfer that sound into an instrument or even onto a piece of paper to read later. Just about anyone can learn how to make music. As long as they have the patience and the will to do so.

I'm having the same problem myself. I learned how to play a bass guitar when I was younger, but I stopped. I could probably still pick one up and play some chords and scales just from memory, but for the most part I don't know it as well as I did then. I didn't, however, really learn how to read or write music. When it comes to electronic music, a lot of it is done through a piano/keyboard which is not the same as other instruments. Just cause you know how to play a Trombone doesn't mean you can sit down at a piano and start playing Mozart. So any knowledge that I've retained about the bass over the years has pretty much no effect on my ability to play the keyboard.

With the internet today you can learn a lot online. There's all kinds of videos and books and sites dedicated to this. A lot of them are even free. It does help, in the beginning to have a live teacher because they will teach you the basics. Not just the basics of the instruments, but things like posture, hand placement and other things. They will be able to prevent you from learning bad habits in the beginning that will slow down your learning process. But these things won't prevent you from being able to teach yourself either. Here's a link to a nice little program that I use all the time to help me out: http://www.scaletool.com/ .
It's a really useful tool to have.

Recessive Trait wrote:not everybody was meant to make music, and nobody can teach you how to write a melody.

Yes they can its not some secret skill set or something, learn music theory. Learn how to write music not dubstep

read this http://ravenspiral.com/rsg2mt/rsg2mt.pdf

print it out and bind it and keep it by your workplace.

it really is an excellent beginners theory guide for people who cant read music.