Dubstepforum.com

hey guys,

Ive been learning for around 5 days now, ive got the basics of ableton and dubstep down however i feel theres so much left to learn.

Ive read almost all the production bible over the last few days but find my self unable to understand some of the concepts and terminology.

Ive also watched hours and hours of tutorials on youtube

Is there a good / recommended order to learn the production process ? as im getting a bit lost in in

despite the hate it gaines im looking to producer more 'brosteppy' dubstep purely as i think itll be easier to dance to and more fitting to the places i DJ down here in Bournemouth,
though I hope to move onto the more intricate atmospheric dubstep after !

Im having problems with peoples comments on the standard bro step noises, i cant piece them together to make a good drop section etc and with resampling etc i just get a noise that isnt very music atall !

Thanks for any help guys heres a quick demo of a track i built as i was learning, i know its bad but i wanted something to show for my efforts:

http://soundcloud.com/djtigerblood/dark-dub

My advice to begin learning to produce starts before the actualy production process, setup your DAW so that you can pickup and go, create a template in ableton with enough tracks that you feel you need to get a basic flow going.

Nothing drains creativity like spending thirty minutes getting your shit together, by that point you've lost ideas.

Start working on basic drum patterns, then mix those drum patterns up, there are a number of "generic" drum patterns and If you'd like I'll upload a project file with different examples to get you started. If you're looking for basic strong structure, the production bible has everything in there.

Astral wrote:My advice to begin learning to produce starts before the actualy production process, setup your DAW so that you can pickup and go, create a template in ableton with enough tracks that you feel you need to get a basic flow going.

Nothing drains creativity like spending thirty minutes getting your shit together, by that point you've lost ideas.

Start working on basic drum patterns, then mix those drum patterns up, there are a number of "generic" drum patterns and If you'd like I'll upload a project file with different examples to get you started. If you're looking for basic strong structure, the production bible has everything in there.

ok thanks, project file would be great i did google for some to reverse engineer but couldnt find any, im having trouble building interesting drum loops and since they sound stale the whole song is kinda dull so any help there would be great. Also i cant find a good tutorial on the EQing for dubstep drums in ableton specifically.

thanks for the help !

I reckon you are better off learning the basic building blocks before you start tryna get tracks together. Think of it like lego, learn all the little pieces (there are a lot, but individually they arent complex) and gradually start putting them together, then combine these bits into larger elements of knowledge. I know that might seem a bit generic sorry.

erratech wrote:I reckon you are better off learning the basic building blocks before you start tryna get tracks together. Think of it like lego, learn all the little pieces (there are a lot, but individually they arent complex) and gradually start putting them together, then combine these bits into larger elements of knowledge. I know that might seem a bit generic sorry.

yeah i know what you mean, but there must be a best order to learn the basics rather than looking at random areas

Experiment!

+

DSF.

And yeah, clock youtube tuts. You can't knock em if they're teaching you a basic grasp of your synthesiser/DAW.
Good luck and don't be afraid to ask if you need anything.

practice, every day

thanks guys, yeah i try and set aside 2-3 hours a day to try stuff out,

However im just unsure what to learn to form my basics.

Is it like:

DAW
Drums
Bass
Other Synthes
EQing ?

As i get most of it just im having a hard time learning EQ and also getting the distorted bass from, bro steppy songs despite following 4-5 hours of tutorial

Top tip : Just keep making shit tunes and one day theyll stop being shit.

The best way to learn is at your own pace using the technique you prefer most.

I am 95% self taught, I think Ive gotten around a handful in pieces of advice from other people or on the internet and thats mainly just how things work, like compressors or FM synthesis. The rest I just worked out on my own, it took me around 3 years to make something worth a damn and 3 years on from that I am at present day and I have to say that I still stick by my roots and learn as I go along, I prefer it that way and keeps my mind and my music rich and I am always breaking through barriers Ive discovered in the past.

I am not really one for reading books or watching tutorials I think thats like watching a walk through for a game, it takes half the fun out of it but thats just my own opinion!

^ wise words. learn by doing.

Find somebody to collaborate with once in a while. And actually meet in person, no interwebs cloud based sharing shit.

Avoid forums. Just stay in and make tunes.
Begin with your DAW

You'll probably never stop learning. 5 days really isn't enough to be expecting results

Here are some great beginner pdf's for digital music making. The first 2 are great to help get a grasp of a lot of the terms.
http://www.musicradar.com/computermusic ... dfs-246054

Lock yourself in your room with your computer for the next year or so with no cellphone and no internet, you'll get there buddy.

Well, just keep trying and messing around I guess. Follow videos, but after they're done, experiment with whatever you tried to learn from the video, try it over from scratch and just twist and turn knobs.

I heard somewhere that doing covers of other people's songs is a good idea, just like when you're learning guitar, you do covers to get experience. Not sure if that works with Electronic music but, hey, give it a try.

Its a long tough road ahead just set aside as much time as you can for FUN you ll eventually get stricter with your practice and know what to do as you get better so dont think about it too much just enjoy. Also no internet/tv and a big bag of dope have helped me immensly.

This is the reason most ppl never get off the ground...They try to do to much at one time like downloading tons of vsts and plugins...if you wana make brostep grab massive and 1 drum kit and put in some work...use presets and make shit tunes...Until you get the basic dont worry to much just practice, practice practice.

Tiger Blood wrote:hey guys,

Ive been learning for around 5 days now, ive got the basics of ableton and dubstep down however i feel theres so much left to learn.

learning is not a linear process... 5 days is just about enough for you to get a feel for whats out there that exists to help you make music... and what music is... technically, reading about that stuff should flip your whole comprehension of music and sound in general... and that should reflect on the way you should now hear ur favourite tunes... in a way.. ull end up revisiting your whole conceptualization of it... and THAT, takes time.

So in order to learn the basics, u have to learn a bunch of technical gibberish... and plug them to what you already know... ie to apply them practical-down to earth examples... so they actually make sense... and then, u'll go back to what uve learned, and re-digest it... in a very different fashion... see it with a different edge... and learn even more about it... etc... when they say learning is a never ending process... they dont simply mean theres a great amount of things to learn, they mean theres a whole lot of ways to relearn the same things as well...

Ive read almost all the production bible over the last few days but find my self unable to understand some of the concepts and terminology.

ur a go getter. congrats. u seem very determined and that is very important. so few people do that.. its truly great.

Its normal that u dont understand everything in the dsf bible, as a lot of those things require for you to understand some other things that are in it. there is some basic, but also some intermediate things in there...

if u have understood my first point, ull now understand that its virtually impossible for u to ''get'' everything from the first reading... since even the basics will require some mental processing and time, before u get them, and then get the more advanced stuff thats in there...

but dont give up.

Ive also watched hours and hours of tutorials on youtube

Good. hopefully uve realized theres more then one way to do things...

What uve just did... was great homie..

So... the things uve just described tell me u tend to apprehend learning as an info-assimilation process... imo, its a route on may take, and i think its a good, and often overlooked one, as its a great part of the learning process as a whole. Completing my Ba, ive noticed there's a great benefit to batch-learning stuff.. u progress quickly and its very inspiring... gives u some matter to juggle with...

however, theres a whole lot of things ull never get by doing just that. and that leads me to a point almost everyone made as a response to your post..

with all ive just read. theres at least one thing missing. and that has to be one of the most important in your situation. as its been stated already : Practice.

theres also other things that have been cited... and they all seem pertinent to my very humble not-so-noobish-noob opinion...

...

however, the major issue ure experiencing.. seems to be of different nature ... and, very, very humbly, i will tell u to... pay attention.. cause i think its the most meaningful shit ive gotten to undertsand.. even tho it might make very little sense at first... read it mutherfucker... read it...

first point, about the things u should do first

I will use the term "discrete technique of acquisition of knoweldge"... by that...i mean = "the things u want us to list in order of priority"....

So, when adopting a discrete technique of acquisition of knowledge.. theres the things you do (eg : read, experiment, collect sounds) and which ones u could do instead of others... (thats what uve been asking)

but there's also the way you do those things.. and to me.. THAT makes a whole lot of difference on the discrete task of ''learning one thing''.. (thats why some people will tell u such and such things dont work, while others will tell u it does)

two people could make the same ''learning exercise'' (eg: as u did by reading a whole lot of shit) and come up with different results... (ie two people could learn by experimenting only, or reading only (either one, the same for both) and still come out different).. thats because the WAY they tackle their learning task is gonna make the whole difference imo... (its a partial definition of talent if u ask me)

very humbly, heres a couple things i do in order to optimize my theoretical learning.. THERE COULD BE A WHOLE LOT MORE :

- learn by heart, memorize, recuperate the info once its vanished from my consciousness..
- make conceptual associations, links.... juggle with those concepts within my mind...
- write about my impressions on a subject... how it should translate to the real world...
- discuss those ideas with other people (thus, the forum)

here's a couple things i do to optimize my practical learning, again, there could be a shitload else of stuff :

- spend time fiddling each knob, each function...
- apply things in a rather exaggerated fashion, to get the idea about them and see how far they go (eg, slam compressors)...
- finishing a song in 15 minutes...
- making a song with defined constrains
- spending a whole day doing the same shit...

hell, u can even get better without reading or applying.. eg : listening to music, engaging in other activities, thinking about music, having emotions... etc..

second point : about the way you should decide which thing you should do first..

however... all of those things ive just listed.. if u ask me... are very, very, very, limited when isolated from one another ... and thats the whole point of my novel here...


THE THING YOU SHOULD ULTIMATELY DO

so here's the thing id put up top of my list of priorities if i were u, and id ALWAYS leave it there :

- getting good at recognizing where my very current lacks are, in whatever it is that i do... and then tackle them with any of the learning techniques that are gonna be listed on this thread....

... to me, its the best way to learn.

i know, it sounds esoteric and shit... but hear me well :

Learning is not a linear process..
You are gonna go back and forth between the things u learn
You are gonna go back to certain things you've learned to relearn them
You are gonna need time to process them
You wont be able to stick to a single thing, learn it inside out, call it a day, then go on with another thing...

Is there a good / recommended order to learn the production process ? as im getting a bit lost in in

You want a list of the things you should do... good...

however, If you produce a list of things you should learn in order, that list is gonna CHANGE, over time...

sometimes with the same items in it...

the task you're trying to assess here, is one ull ALWAYS have to assess...

Your question : whats the right order of doing things?
The way id ask it is more like : what's next for now? what do i have to learn NOW?

its something i ask myself EVERYDAY... .

Here's what i mean :
sometimes, i go and feel like.. wow... i really dont know what im doing tweaking those knobs... then, i know READING about the knob of that unit.. is going to help me understand what im doing...

some other times, i feel like i have a theoretical understanding of something, (eq in my case a the moment), but whenever i do it, it sounds like shit... then i know i need to actually spend some time DOING it... and knowing how it translates to the real world... and train my ears to hear it... and develop a taste for it... a style and shit..

sometimes, i feel like ive well understood my tools, and shit, and that theres only so much i could do with them... or that some other tools might flip the whole process into something else, then i go on the internet and SEARCH FOR SOME NEW TOOLS..

sometimes i feel like my way of working is too slow... then i feel its because i lack in workflow, and very basic technical knowledge (how does my computer work (my daw for instance), do i have a good mouse, is my computer too slow... could i get better converters for my soundcard, should i treat my room).. and i go on and watch a training video about my daw... or read about what refurbishing i could give my creative environment...

sometimes i dont know what i should learn, and dont feel like i want to make music.. and during those times... i go back to what ive done in the past... especially to what ive read... and revisit it... and thats when i get a whole new sight of the very same things ive seen sometime in the past...

shit, sometimes i feel like i need to feel music, and just put on some juke mix and sponge bob in my room for hours... and that is very pedagogical as well..

the point is, it goes in a circle, a straight line, a curve and a back and forth motion, all at the same time...

its a never ending process...

thats called INTEGRATING knowledge...

knowledge applies to various dimensions..

to integrate it, u have to let ur endeavors collide with all these dimensions...

how ? : ------» know what u need to learn, everytime...


YOUR NEXT STEP :

Personally, I think your next step... is to spend some time fucking around with knobs... not knowing shit about music, and just experimenting....

take your time. practice... practice, practice..(and then practice again)

Im having problems with peoples comments on the standard bro step noises, i cant piece them together to make a good drop section etc and with resampling etc i just get a noise that isnt very music atall !

pure example of how important it is to practice. everything that you've read shows u HOW to do stuff (technical)... theres very little info about WHAT to do... and that comes with time... cause time will give you the tools and technical vocabulary necessary to take the right decisions and APPLY them... again, practice...

there's a very good answer to that, and if i were u id follow that :

SilentGhost wrote:This is the reason most ppl never get off the ground... ... if you wana make brostep grab massive and 1 drum kit and put in some work...use presets and make shit tunes...Until you get the basic dont worry to much just practice, practice practice.

Thanks

Aw dawg, u shouldnt, aw well... De nada

dhttp://www.amazon.com/Dance-Music-Manual-Secon ... b_title_bk

book's loaded with info, some background knowledge helps but i found this book to be very helpful in further understanding some of the building blocks of production. still a fantastic reference book to have around