[POLL] The Dubs board - problems & how to fix them

[wub]

Ok, so the Dubs board...

• What problems do you think it has at the moment?
• Do you have any suggestions on how to fix these problems?
• What changes/new features would you like to see?

Please discuss

[hudson]

I used it for a while, but I stopped because it was completely useless to me. Everything I posted (even after spending a few hours giving feedback) would quickly disappear among songs by people I've never seen posting before. And even though my threads would get 20+ views, I never got a lick of feedback in the 5 or so times I think I posted there, not even after a few bumps.

I think there should be similar rules to the WIP thread, that way more people would get feedback before their track plummets to the bottom of the page.

I realize the forum isn't just for feedback, but it's the only part of that board I think is failing.

[Teknicyde]

i used to post in dubs forum, but dubs forum used to mean something totally different before production mods got a hold of it.

Once upon a time, it was a promotional area, where I could go to get simple yes or no reactions from the general public on tunes... But, people complained that their threads didnt get enough attention, so we turned it into another place on DSF producers could go and give heartless '2db here' criticism n stroke each others egos... Whereas once, they did that on the stickies here and dubs wasnt a production place...

Basically, go back to how it was 7-8 months ago, before it was a producer circle jerk talking about kickdrum frequencies... when it was general listeners saying whether they liked a tune or not.

People on DSF worry too much about what other producers think of their music. This place breeds a serious contempt for those of us who just want to promote, not play producer circle stroke.

And, from friends who dont produce and once went to dubs for dj material/listening 'I dont understand what anyones saying in there anymore'...

Bring back production feedback, get rid of releases section, yeah... dubs was awesome before everyone started trying to fix it.

[legend4ry]

I always get a lot of feedback in Dubs and don't really see a problem?

[Teknicyde]

I used it for a while, but I stopped because it was completely useless to me. Everything I posted (even after spending a few hours giving feedback) would quickly disappear among songs by people I've never seen posting before..

But this is something the mods cant fix. Its a fair market environment, and the mods shouldnt be in charge of making sure everyone gets the same response. Its your job to promote and make great tunes. If you make great tunes, theyll stand out.

Making it so everyone gets the same amount of replies isnt improving anything imo, its sheltering people.

[wub]

Would sub dividing the Dubs board help?

For example;

Dubs
> Tunes needing feedback
> Tunes for free download
> Tunes that are forthcoming releases

?

[FSTZ]

not trying to come off like a cynical PRK, but this forum is oversaturated now and the sense of community that used to make this place cool has withered away.

I still like to offer help with the things I know about here in the production board, but I'm not going to waste my time trying to post my tunes up for feedback.

IMO only way to fix the dubs board is to time travel back to 2007 / 2008

I wish I felt differently

[-[2]DAY_-]

I use it to look for dubs from good producers
you find awesome tracks just floating around there, often for free DL.

IMO, the only way to improve it would be to stop with the F4F shit.
F4F is something you should find in your own circle. AIM, SC, Facebook, twitter, telephone, real life, etc. and the Production forum, if it's wanted here.

DUBS ought to be where your work gets a YES or a NO, as stated above ^

[hudson]

I always get a lot of feedback in Dubs and don't really see a problem?

Check out some of the other threads though. Guys like you, Basic A, Kaori, whoever get way more feedback because of their status here. Not saying your music isn't good, I love all three of the artists I mentioned, but it always seems to be the same few guys who get lots of feedback. It's easier to listen to one of your tunes than someone who may be just trying to find their sound.

But this is something the mods cant fix. Its a fair market environment, and the mods shouldnt be in charge of making sure everyone gets the same response. Its your job to promote and make great tunes. If you make great tunes, theyll stand out.

Making it so everyone gets the same amount of replies isnt improving anything imo, its sheltering people.

I'm not saying everyone should get a fair amount, obviously more people will want to listen to Legend4ry's songs than mine, and I'm okay with that, I just think that producers should be required to give one or two bits of general feedback before they post their song. And if it did change to how it used to be, producers would only be a small amount of the people on the board, the one's who are strictly listeners can comment on whatever they want.

[-[2]DAY_-]

Would sub dividing the Dubs board help?

For example;

Dubs
> Tunes needing feedback
> Tunes for free download
> Tunes that are forthcoming releases

?

the needing feedback thing... i mean, everyone needs feedback. it goes without saying. at the risk of sounding like a cold, heartless douche, people need to stop ASKING and BEGGING for it. its pathetic. "Dubs" is enough of a sub-forum as is. its the one where you put your dubs. Free DL threads are a treat when the tune is good, and when it sucks, they're worthless. simple.
But Feedback threads... its like if i hate it, do you still want my fb? should i go out of my way to help you improve technique, or criticize your style? should i just say "I don't like it because __"? People want to generate chatter of and about themselves, so they're worried more about how many posts they get than how their music sounds. If the users were less emotional and more logical, it would work fine.

people can say in their thread - "i'm promoting this as its forthcoming ..." "this is a free tune" or "i'd like to know what you think i might improve"
No matter what, it should still boil down to Good or No Good. and the top forum posts should reflect that, the quality of the music. Perhaps a simple poll or rating system would work. But spamming would be rampant. i dunno

[wub]

the needing feedback thing... i mean, everyone needs feedback. it goes without saying. at the risk of sounding like a cold, heartless douche, people need to stop ASKING and BEGGING for it. its pathetic.

Not every tune needs feedback though - for example, tunes that people are happy to have for download/getting released on a label or whatever probably don't need feedback.

[Teknicyde]

Basic A.

i changed my alias and noticed no increase/decrease in feedback, so its not name loyalty or loyalty to people with 2009 join dates or whatever, therefore that arguement is invalid. Also, if you look around the dubs forum, right now, Im being called out/trolled there. So. You pick. Smaller reply count and constructive feedback, or haters making troll threads about you and showing up to dis you in your threads? its not because of status here, but because people like legend4ry and I, we've worked hard to make good tunes and build faithful listeners. Half the people you see reply to my threads, I forward here from AIM/Facebook/soundcloud/local music forums/ect, check their post counts. Promote. I dont just post threads and have them hit 3 pages over a join date/post count...

think that producers should be required to give one or two bits of general feedback before they post their song.

Well, the thing is, for one, when I started posting in dubs, artists I have endless respect for used to post there, like Skream for example as someone who sticks out... Do you really suppose someone who helped sculpt the genre should have to give feedback? At this point, we've made 2 dubs forums, a release forum and the actual dubs forum, and the bigger names I used to see in dubs and think 'hey, if nothing else, maybe they're one of the views', those names are gone because they have no reason to post there anymore, much less stumble into random threads.

Also, if everyone were required to give feedback before they could get it... how would you enforce that rule? And whats to stop me from giving my feedback to a few personal contacts vs. giving it to someone who wouldnt get it otherwise? If that rule was enforced, Id probably skirt right around all the unknown threads, drop feedback to a few regulars just to get it out of the way, and post my thread...

the needing feedback thing... i mean, everyone needs feedback. it goes without saying. at the risk of sounding like a cold, heartless douche, people need to stop ASKING and BEGGING for it. its pathetic.

Not every tune needs feedback though - for example, tunes that people are happy to have for download/getting released on a label or whatever probably don't need feedback.

By the time Ive paid for mastering on a tune, i dont need you to suggest I use a different vocal sample.

[FSTZ]

By the time Ive paid for mastering on a tune, i dont need you to suggest I use a different vocal sample.

[jrisreal]

By the time Ive paid for mastering on a tune, i dont need you to suggest I use a different vocal sample.

[hudson]

So then how do you suppose the dubs forum could be improved? I don't have much invested in making it better, I'm just giving some suggestions.

And I know it's not totally name loyalty, but it does seem like people are more likely to post in threads with a decent amount of comments already. Those comments could come from people who really liked it and felt the need to comment, or people who have been directed to the thread by the artist, but I know that the amount of feedback you get there isn't entirely based on the quality of the music.

I've posted most of my songs there, and have never gotten a single comment, but, for example, you complimented one of my songs that was on for no more than 30 seconds in that big sub.fm mix a while ago, and Darigan recently said that my song was his favorite submission for the DSF mix he made last month. Both of those songs were posted, then bumped a few days later on the dubs board, neither of them got any feedback. I get plenty of positive feedback from random people outside of the dubs board, but absolutely nothing on it.

Like I said, I'm not super pissed about it, it's not a big issue in my life. I get feedback from other places, but more would always be nice, it's good to know how other people hear my music.

[Teknicyde]

I get plenty of positive feedback from random people outside of the dubs board, but absolutely nothing on it.

Be like, hey, yo, since you liked it, could you spare a bump?

[FSTZ]

the dubs section is just too convoluted now and the value that used to exist has been replaced by soundcloud

that's where people are getting their feedback from

[fragments]

I agree with Tecknicyde, I used to make an effort and post a few of my own things until the F4F circle jerk started. I have absolutely no suggestions for fixing it, but have turned to SoundCloud groups as a place to find well made free releases from people.

Also, what's with all the "I'm the best producer in the world, check my shit out" ego/attitude posts? People need taken down a peg or two...

[-[2]DAY_-]

c-zar is an atypical, irritating phenomenon. He's a troll who produces.

[Shum]

I only use the dubs board to listen to tracks (when I have the time) and offer the occasional suggestion/ big up. For that purpose it works well enough.