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Thought it would be cool to get a rolling thread going on this, so any tips, problems with getting a certain sound etc. Gives everyone somewhere to go anyway.

Anyway, i'll go first..

Really struggling to get these techno pads, sounds really hard on impact then has that sort of hollow tail, things like this



and then in a dubstep context



Would appreciate any help

The hardest part for me is the structure of the tune; I want it to sound interesting and not loopy...something you can listen to on headphones. At the same time, when I DJ house, I just want something minimal for as long as possible for mixing.

cloak and dagger wrote:The hardest part for me is the structure of the tune; I want it to sound interesting and not loopy...something you can listen to on headphones. At the same time, when I DJ house, I just want something minimal for as long as possible for mixing.

Just watching this now http://www.redbullmusicacademy.com/lect ... eat-depths

Talks a lot about arrangement and structure, might be useful. I tend to automate sending things to buses with modulation effects on them if i'm doing a long intro, maybe a phaser and then one with delay on it... sidechaining a bus with reverb on it against the channel that its receiving the signal from.. and then edit the lengths of the midi notes and velocity on things like the hi hats so they're not all sounding the same

Drop_Dead wrote:Anyway, i'll go first..

Really struggling to get these techno pads, sounds really hard on impact then has that sort of hollow tail, things like this



and then in a dubstep context



Would appreciate any help

this andy stott tune is sick cheers. as for the pads, you want to have like a real real quick attack, and then a fairly quick decay too, like experiment with below half way down, and then like a really low sustain, but with a fairly long release. so then like it should snap real quick, but after the snap it should be fairly quite as the sustain is really low, but then it will ring out because of the release. you could then compress it quite hard with a slower attack so that the transient is let through, but then the tail is compressed so it hits even harder and then tail is tamer. obviously then youd want to experiment with some reverb like maybe 2 ms or something? and delays. sounds like they are square waves too which might add to the hollow feel.

skimpi wrote:

Drop_Dead wrote:Anyway, i'll go first..

Really struggling to get these techno pads, sounds really hard on impact then has that sort of hollow tail, things like this



Would appreciate any help

this andy stott tune is sick cheers. as for the pads, you want to have like a real real quick attack, and then a fairly quick decay too, like experiment with below half way down, and then like a really low sustain, but with a fairly long release. so then like it should snap real quick, but after the snap it should be fairly quite as the sustain is really low, but then it will ring out because of the release. you could then compress it quite hard with a slower attack so that the transient is let through, but then the tail is compressed so it hits even harder and then tail is tamer. obviously then youd want to experiment with some reverb like maybe 2 ms or something? and delays. sounds like they are square waves too which might add to the hollow feel.

Awesome, that sounds really promising thanks a lot

skimpi wrote:

Drop_Dead wrote:Anyway, i'll go first..

Really struggling to get these techno pads, sounds really hard on impact then has that sort of hollow tail, things like this



and then in a dubstep context



Would appreciate any help

this andy stott tune is sick cheers. as for the pads, you want to have like a real real quick attack, and then a fairly quick decay too, like experiment with below half way down, and then like a really low sustain, but with a fairly long release. so then like it should snap real quick, but after the snap it should be fairly quite as the sustain is really low, but then it will ring out because of the release. you could then compress it quite hard with a slower attack so that the transient is let through, but then the tail is compressed so it hits even harder and then tail is tamer. obviously then youd want to experiment with some reverb like maybe 2 ms or something? and delays. sounds like they are square waves too which might add to the hollow feel.

This works (I build it up from some organ patch btw). This translates to Reason very well, not like most production tips.

That Andy Stott tune is nice! Some of those sounds almost have an FM sort of quality to them. I know FM synths were used a lot in Techno.

mks wrote:That Andy Stott tune is nice! Some of those sounds almost have an FM sort of quality to them. I know FM synths were used a lot in Techno.

Yeah I use the EFM1 in Logic quite a bit and it gets some nice sound such as the main synth in M.A.R.S by Scuba but its a bit more harsh I find than the ones in Night Jewel

wow finally a house thread?
I'm glad i'm not the only one

basically... if you want to recreate a good minimal feel with any authenticity.... i don't see any way around this: you just have to listen to tons of techno. it has no limitations, it can expand as far as your mind. you start with a groove. then you let your mind wander and add all those wanderings in as the song progresses. one of my favorite art forms.

Sounds like a great idea

AFROJACK FTW




(jk)

Drop_Dead wrote:Anyway, i'll go first..

Really struggling to get these techno pads, sounds really hard on impact then has that sort of hollow tail, things like this
and then in a dubstep context

Would appreciate any help

Love those stabs, they are a staple in dub techno and deep house tunes. Check the tune currently in my sig, similar sounds done in massive then ran into tape. Basically what skimpi said, yeah. Get yourself a good filter, or a synth with a nice filter and use square/pulse or saw waves or one of each. Detune to taste, and apply a band pass or low pass filter depending on the sound you're after. LFO or envelope (I prefer envelopes, but LFOs work) on the filter and the release, and modulate them both to taste. Any softsynth works, but Massive and Sylenth are ones I love to program those sounds in as far as VSTs go. For a more "metallic" sounding stab like in the Night Jewel tune, a band pass works nicely. I've made that exact sound using this method many times. Just find the sweet spot in the filter and modulate a little bit, not a lot.

The most important thing is probably the chords though. You won't get anywhere unless you play the right chords. Go for minor chords like m7, m9 work really well. Modulate the reverb and delays a lot too.

FM synths work well yeah, DX7 or clones especially.

wormcode wrote:

Drop_Dead wrote:Anyway, i'll go first..

Really struggling to get these techno pads, sounds really hard on impact then has that sort of hollow tail, things like this
and then in a dubstep context

Would appreciate any help

Love those stabs, they are a staple in dub techno and deep house tunes. Check the tune currently in my sig, similar sounds done in massive then ran into tape. Basically what skimpi said, yeah. Get yourself a good filter, or a synth with a nice filter and use square/pulse or saw waves or one of each. Detune to taste, and apply a band pass or low pass filter depending on the sound you're after. LFO or envelope (I prefer envelopes, but LFOs work) on the filter and the release, and modulate them both to taste. Any softsynth works, but Massive and Sylenth are ones I love to program those sounds in as far as VSTs go. For a more "metallic" sounding stab like in the Night Jewel tune, a band pass works nicely. I've made that exact sound using this method many times. Just find the sweet spot in the filter and modulate a little bit, not a lot.

The most important thing is probably the chords though. You won't get anywhere unless you play the right chords. Go for minor chords like m7, m9 work really well. Modulate the reverb and delays a lot too.

FM synths work well yeah, DX7 or clones especially.

Thanks a lot mate thats done the job perfectly

not techno or house

but i like this thread

very simple question on this garage tune- how would you go about making the kind of organy pad noise in the intro?

Good idea for a a thread, i'll contribute soon, am in the works of the first tune i'm proud of, it's basically sub heavy house/techno, quite loosely linked though, will upload when complete.

On a techno note, check out the latest frozen border, number 10, it's great

http://boomkat.com/vinyl/471636-frozen-border-fb10-4-26

in the second track i'd like to know how to make the lower frequency stabs, I'm assuming they're square wave. Any tips appreciated, not trying to replicate his sound just curious

Agreed, nice to have these dub-techno synth sounds talked about here, because I've been thinking about and working with them a fair amount recently. One simple thing I've found useful for getting evocative timbres is to set a filter (LP or BP probably) on the synth to a fairly high resonance, but not give the filter any envelope, so that the resonant frequency remains the same throughout the note rather than sweeping up/down via the envelope. This can give the sound more of a feel of coming from a particular space or place, I guess, because of the consistent resonant frequency, instead of any kind of "beeeewwwwww" or acidic quality that you'd get if it were sweeping. I like this for both stabs and sustained pads. The resonance can give a really different, original, alien timbral feel to the basic waveforms. It works quite well with (as discussed above) a detuned square or saw oscillator, or an FM tone - I'm a huge fan of FM and there's so much you can do with it. You may also want to have another, enveloped filter in the signal chain depending on what you're looking for.

skimpi's mention of letting the release tail drag out long after a short stab is also something I've stumbled on in my recent experiments, and contrary to the constant resonant frequency previously mentioned, here I really like having a filter envelope and making it release slowly along with the amp envelope so that it gives a slowly evolving, potentially really interesting sound. I used that idea starting at 3:21 of my current sig tune (Forest Swim, for when I switch my sig up) on the FM bell sound (I automated the release to get much longer right there and at the end of the tune and be shorter through most of it).

Also, side note, experiment with comb filters (used them on that bell sound too). That's just a general plug.

lately ive understood that most tech transitions are achievable thru effect modulations... if u want the arrangement to flow u have to mess with bunch of effects reminiscent of dj mixing tools... i simply apprehend the arrangement as a mix between different songs... and apply the "best" technique, or the one i think has the most impact... (filtering, reverb, etc)

what always mesmerizes me with beats with a spot-on tech influence, is the efficiency of the elements that are used... its such a dope and pure style... groove oriented.. that it keeps a minimal side even when the arrangement is full of tweaks...

im amazed by grooves...

my big lack of skill : hats and grooves.. i DONT understand the basic tec hihat pattern... it seems like its mechanical, but not repetitive...

a little dopeness for yall :

Ldizzy wrote:lately ive understood that most tech transitions are achievable thru effect modulations... if u want the arrangement to flow u have to mess with bunch of effects reminiscent of dj mixing tools... i simply apprehend the arrangement as a mix between different songs... and apply the "best" technique, or the one i think has the most impact... (filtering, reverb, etc)

what always mesmerizes me with beats with a spot-on tech influence, is the efficiency of the elements that are used... its such a dope and pure style... groove oriented.. that it keeps a minimal side even when the arrangement is full of tweaks...

im amazed by grooves...

my big lack of skill : hats and grooves.. i DONT understand the basic tec hihat pattern... it seems like its mechanical, but not repetitive...

a little dopeness for yall :

Groove was the main thing I wanted my tracks to have and is always a main thing I have in mind when approaching a tune. I've only recently begun to find my tunes have the sort of groove/flow that i'm after and that's just been through spending a lot of my time working on percussion patterns, couldn't give specifics everythings just working better together to create flow.

adding to what you've said not all techno keeps a minimal side whilst having groove, take T++ or surgeon for example, really textured music and grooving.

Can anyone explain how I can get a kick/bass like in this Ben Klock track:



I want to get those deep sounding drums. I've tried adding a touch of reverb to kick samples and I tried
making my own kick sound with a synth but I'm not getting the desired effect. To me it sounds like the kicks
are really 'long'. I use Reason btw.