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Noobtastic question.

When i make music, I feel like it totally sucks. So i Have a few questions.

1. does everybody feel that way when they start?
2. what is your process? where do you start?
3.is there a set of "rules" to live by (yea yea "electric music has no rules man!) i just mean general tips and things to avoid
4. any good suggestions for books to read on electronic music builds
5. little off topic. how do you make that Slow down sound in your synths? Like in "Blackout"

please keep the hate to a minimum. i know these questions are basic. i just wanna make Electric music as a hobby.

Thanks. love the forum


Tim
MAC OSX Ableton live 8. M-audio ozone. NI massive, FM8.
Skrillex, Porter robinson, Modestep, Datsik, Megaladon.

its gonna suck for a while. dont compare your music to other peoples its just hurting yourself. just mess around and keep making beats even if they suck just keep pushing through songs. each tune will get better. then youll reach a point where your like wow this sounds good and its awesome. then your going to realize again that it still sucks compared to other people. its just a cycle that you gotta push through.

in general for making a song sound cohesive and decent. try getting an idea or a theme before you start each tune. then gather all your sounds based on what you think fits that theme. so gather all your percussion hits, make a few basses, make a lead, and make or find some nice atmospheric pads. get your sounds sounding decent enough to use. then go on to writing your song. once you write most of the song, keep it simple by the way... then you can go onto fine tune your sounds and mix the song down.

I still feel like my stuff sucks, but apparently some people like it.

Once you stop trying to imitate someone else's sound and you just do you and make your own music, then you'll stop feeling like you suck, sort of.

I disagree with Eat Bass on not comparing your tunes with other peoples tunes. I do that all the time especially with famous artists....that's pretty much my only goal I have for production: To make everything sound awesome.

I promise you 110% for sure that a lot of the "professional sounding shit" is from mastering/mixing tools. And before that make sure you make some quality patches and combine a shit ton of synths, with a wobble to make things sound fuller.

1. does everybody feel that way when they start?
Yes, when I look back on my first tracks, I'm surprised I didn't think they sucked more.

2. what is your process? where do you start?
I start by messing with chords, tend to make a melody that fits and then start messing with structure. I generally lay out a song with basic presets before creating my own synth patches.

4. any good suggestions for books to read on electronic music builds
Not a book suggestion, but for me I feel my production got better after I watched/read quite a few tutorials on music theory mainly related to playing and composing for piano.

Eat Bass wrote: then youll reach a point where your like wow this sounds good and its awesome. then your going to realize again that it still sucks compared to other people. its just a cycle that you gotta push through.

So true... And it's totally normal for an artist to be very critical of his own work. Even when other people dig your productions it might still sound like crap to you, and that's a good thing, because it's going to motivate you to do better.

Once a month or so I like to go through all my own work and take notes on what I would do differently with it if I was re-doing it today. Keep those notes by your side when you work on something new, look at them occasionally, and ask yourself "Am I avoiding these pitfalls?"

1. Yes and it will last a long time. Making music requires a lot of learning and a lot of different skills.

2. Well, I must say I'm as random as it gets. First, I separate sound design sessions from writing sessions. In between tracks I spend a lot of time in sound design sessions, saving the patches in my folder (it's the most valuable folder in my computer) and ideas in "idea projects". I may sound design during writing sessions but it's very rare.
Then when I want to start a track I first build some simple drum line, grab a patch, play randomly with the keyboard till I find a combination of notes I like and make a line of it (with lots of space for the other sounds I add later). Then I start grabbing more patches and filling it in, doing a lot of back tracking along the way (basically, my "secret" is do it random then fix it till it sounds good). If the drop I end up with is good enough, I start writing.
Also, I don't build an idea in my head as Eat Bass said. Well, I might, but it will end up pretty differently. My only guide is to make something that makes me dance and that I want to play in repeat. But keep in mind I'm a bit more experienced than you. I can say I liked my first tracks but I must have been completely delusional since they were a big piece of sh*t lol (thank god we didn't have soundcloud or myspace at that time lol).

3. Hmm I don't know... play notes on a scale? make each part a multiple of 16 bars?

4. More like forums and listening A LOT to music analytically.

Basically, keep sucking until you don't suck anymore. It's discouraging, but you'll get there if you keep at it. I promise. I found this quote the other day and it's cheesy as hell but it's definitely great advice.

“Nobody tells this to people who are beginners, I wish someone told me. All of us who do creative work, we get into it because we have good taste. But there is this gap. For the first couple years you make stuff, it’s just not that good. It’s trying to be good, it has potential, but it’s not. But your taste, the thing that got you into the game, is still killer. And your taste is why your work disappoints you. A lot of people never get past this phase, they quit. Most people I know who do interesting, creative work went through years of this. We know our work doesn’t have this special thing that we want it to have. We all go through this. And if you are just starting out or you are still in this phase, you gotta know its normal and the most important thing you can do is do a lot of work. Put yourself on a deadline so that every week you will finish one story. It is only by going through a volume of work that you will close that gap, and your work will be as good as your ambitions. And I took longer to figure out how to do this than anyone I’ve ever met. It’s gonna take awhile. It’s normal to take awhile. You’ve just gotta fight your way through.”

Read interviews from any of your favorite artists; they've been at it for years. Take your time.

“Nobody tells this to people who are beginners, I wish someone told me. All of us who do creative work, we get into it because we have good taste. But there is this gap. For the first couple years you make stuff, it’s just not that good. It’s trying to be good, it has potential, but it’s not. But your taste, the thing that got you into the game, is still killer. And your taste is why your work disappoints you. A lot of people never get past this phase, they quit. Most people I know who do interesting, creative work went through years of this. We know our work doesn’t have this special thing that we want it to have. We all go through this. And if you are just starting out or you are still in this phase, you gotta know its normal and the most important thing you can do is do a lot of work. Put yourself on a deadline so that every week you will finish one story. It is only by going through a volume of work that you will close that gap, and your work will be as good as your ambitions. And I took longer to figure out how to do this than anyone I’ve ever met. It’s gonna take awhile. It’s normal to take awhile. You’ve just gotta fight your way through.”

― Ira Glass

for those of you who say you disagree with not comparing your music to others...i only meant that when your very very new to producing. obviously when you get better you want to compare to make changes. but when your very knew to everything and cant make anything worth listening its better just to make beats to get your workflow in order and gain a bit more skill and knowledge. thats just me personally, but i know when i first started comparing my tunes to others would just discourage me and leave me with writers block.

timtim366 wrote:1. does everybody feel that way when they start?

Yes.

timtim366 wrote:2. what is your process? where do you start?

Find a sound I like, work on that til it's interesting, then construct my tune around it.

timtim366 wrote:3.is there a set of "rules" to live by (yea yea "electric music has no rules man!) i just mean general tips and things to avoid

Tips - Don't rely too heavily on sample packs/presets, ideas > loudness, learn your synths
Avoid - Massive, limiters, imitating other artists just because they're popular.

timtim366 wrote:4. any good suggestions for books to read on electronic music builds

http://noisesculpture.com/how-to-make-a-noise

timtim366 wrote:5. little off topic. how do you make that Slow down sound in your synths? Like in "Blackout"

Without hearing the song, I'm going to guess it's one of two things;

1) A gradually declining automation envelope on the pitch
2) The LFO gradually reducing (again, automation)

timtim366 wrote:please keep the hate to a minimum. i know these questions are basic. i just wanna make Electric music as a hobby.

You have the right attitude and don't come across like a dick when you're asking questions, you'll be fine

timtim366 wrote:Thanks. love the forum

What's not to love?

timtim366 wrote:Skrillex, Porter robinson, Modestep, Datsik, Megaladon.

Another tip - listen to as many different artists/song/albums from as many different genres as you can. If you only listen to Dubstep/complextro, for example, and then try and make only Dubstep/complextro, it will just be a poorer copy of what you're trying to achieve as you're only listening to and producing a very narrow range of sounds.

Listen to everythiny you can, take influences/steal bits/sample from as many different genres as possible. Your sound will develop, and be better for it.

There'd be a problem if you thought your sounds didn't suck when first start

Keep referencing to other tracks that you like. Mess around with as many effects as possible and really start to get a feel for what affects the sound.

Reading tutorials will get you a lot of the way to understanding what changes the sound but it doesn't come close to hand's on experience.

Good luck on your quest for sonic perfection!

Some good tips in this thread.

My advice is to learn what your stuff does. Understand how compressors work, know how to eq, get to know your DAW like the back of your hand. Understand your different types of synthesis, the "How to make a noise" book has already been linked. Understand gain structuring and mixing theory, and practice, practice, practice.

Do this at the same time that you're playing around with synths, writing your first few songs, finding a style etc.

Balance developing your creative side with learning how to express that creativity.


Edit: Plus be very patient. It's not a short term game.

I feel like some of my songs suck while I make them, but I like the idea, so I keep on trying to get them somewhere. Then, when I've finished them, they're often the ones I enjoy the most.

dididub wrote:
My advice is to learn what your stuff does. Understand how compressors work, know how to eq, get to know your DAW like the back of your hand. Understand your different types of synthesis, the "How to make a noise" book has already been linked. Understand gain structuring and mixing theory, and practice, practice, practice.

+1 Great advice

I thought I was fucking awesome at the start lol but the more I produce the pickier I get. I've been working on my next song for a while now, automating everything and trying to mix it well ect ect.

Comfi wrote:I thought I was fucking awesome at the start lol but the more I produce the pickier I get. I've been working on my next song for a while now, automating everything and trying to mix it well ect ect.

becareful taking longer to automate things and mixing as you go, it may seem beneficial at the time but it can block creative flow for writing your track, try and wait to do that stuff when your track is almost complete in structure
its the worst when you spend a few weeks trying to perfect something so much that you cant finish it and end up scrapping it

man its gonna suck for a long time but if you have a drive and want, it will slowly start shaping into better sounding peices. ive been working at it for a year and im just now at a point where im starting to figure things out.

Soundcloud

1. does everybody feel that way when they start?
I didn't. When I started, I made some really crappy tunes, but in that time, I thought they were freaking awesome.
2. what is your process? where do you start?
I start with whatever idea I have in my head. Sometimes I may have an awesome drum pattern in my head or a melody or a sound design. Different every time.
3.is there a set of "rules" to live by (yea yea "electric music has no rules man!) i just mean general tips and things to avoid
Melody, melody, melody, melody, music theory, melody, chords, melody, melody. Avoid making tunes without some kind of melody or application of melody to make your tunes flow well within itself.
4. any good suggestions for books to read on electronic music builds
I've never read a book on production. If I were to suggest one, I'd suggest one on music theory or playing a non-percussive instrument.
5. little off topic. how do you make that Slow down sound in your synths? Like in "Blackout"
Depends which "Blackout" you are referring to...who is the artist behind the track you are referring to?

A) because they probably do suck

or

B) your composition and other production skills are not up to par with your sound design. good sounds mean nothing if they're not used properly and surrounded with lots of other goodness