100% green to production, need help getting started

[solidus]

The title pretty much sums up my position right now.

To elucidate that and serve as an intro at the same time, I've been a dubstep DJ and been mixing the sound for probably 7-8 months right now, so I have the ins and the outs of the general (and in the most simple sense) structure, basslines, etc. but mixing and blending the tracks for me only gets me so much, and I'd like to increase that amount of self-satisfaction and my output by starting to produce my own stuff.

Right now, however, is the point in the process when I am 100% stuck and have no idea what to expect. To explain my frustration, right now is the point in time when I'm trying to push a car up a hill when that car is stuck in 5th gear and the parking brake is set. It's not that I have no idea how to do this - it's that I have no starting or reference point for where to begin. I've downloaded the dubstep production bible (that was how I originally came on to this site) but that still assumes you have some rough, conceptual knowledge of the structure and how things work.

I cringe when I say this, but right now I need someone to explain to me everything I need to know and/or where to get started. Because right now this is looking all but impossible to me.

[Electric_Head]

http://www.dubstepforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=159713

Dubstep Basics

http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/jul10/a ... ubstep.htm

[ehbes]

http://www.dubstepforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=159713

[solidus]

http://www.dubstepforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=159713

I looked at that, and there's a lot of good stuff, but it still assumes I have some idea of what to expect and that I still have some knowledge of basic principles.

[Electric_Head]

Sorry I was still posting when I submitted, I edited above.

[solidus]

Sorry I was still posting when I submitted, I edited above.

It's fine, I'm looking at the edit now.

I'm running Ableton Live 8 and I have Massive on hand, and I have a *fairly* okay knowledge of the arrangement versus session views and the general layout of Ableton, as well as some infinitesimal knowledge about Massive mainly due to mucking around.

But some of the basic questions I have that the Production Bible and Guide to Producing Dubstep couldn't really answer for me (as they seem to assume I already have some of that knowledge on board):

What are some examples of some commonly used drum patterns, and how do I make them? (it seemed to delve more into logistics about each drum itself rather than tell me how to pattern them)

What is the *general* gist of the dubstep song structure? How do I accomplish that?

[wub]

What are some examples of some commonly used drum patterns, and how do I make them?

140bpm
Kick on the 1 and the 9
Snare on the 5 and the 13
Hats on the 1, 3, 5, 7, etc

Basic Dubstep pattern right there. Adjust to taste.

What is the *general* gist of the dubstep song structure? How do I accomplish that?

Find a song you like, listen to it, and count. Typically you'll be looking at 8 bar intro, then 8 bar build, maybe an 8 bar drop, roll out for 16 bars etc etc. Listening will get you a better idea.

[ehbes]

Just structure everything in terms of 16 bars.. As for drums the most common is kick on the first beat and snare on the second... After that you can do just about anything you want

[Electric_Head]

The sound on sound article goes pretty in depth.
It gives you drum structures, the works.

[wub]

Also get yourself a copy of this;

http://www.musicradar.com/gallery/compu ... w-543660/1

[Brothulhu]

Surely if you have been mixing dubstep for 8 months you know how the drums are generally laid out. If not then load a few tracks into Ableton and arrange some drum samples on top of it in the same pattern, remove the song and look at the pattern.
You can do this with any aspect, not just drums, should help

[solidus]

Surely if you have been mixing dubstep for 8 months you know how the drums are generally laid out. If not then load a few tracks into Ableton and arrange some drum samples on top of it in the same pattern, remove the song and look at the pattern.
You can do this with any aspect, not just drums, should help

That's true, and I do have some rudimentary knowledge of how the drums work out, although it's more along the lines of noticing the tempo of the drums along the section I'd be mixing rather than taking note of the particular layout.

Mixing really didn't prepare me for this (haha) because if you mix something, it can come out sounding like utter crap, but at least you have something. With this I've been in utter deadlock for probably the lesser of two weeks.

140bpm
Kick on the 1 and the 9
Snare on the 5 and the 13
Hats on the 1, 3, 5, 7, etc

Basic Dubstep pattern right there. Adjust to taste.

Now that sounds better, that's more of a starting point.

What is the drop structure (how is it arranged)?

[OfficialDAPT]

What is the drop structure (how is it arranged)?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hhvw5OopK-s
That is a video from two great producers and it will answer most of your structuring questions.

[wub]

What is the drop structure (how is it arranged)?

Drops usually occur anywhere from 16 to 32 bars into a track...preceeded usually by 4/8bars worth of 'build up' (white noise sweeps/rising tones to build the tension + increased frequency on the drum hits) then kill all the drums and have your Massive midrange noises play.

[solidus]

What is the drop structure (how is it arranged)?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hhvw5OopK-s
That is a video from two great producers and it will answer most of your structuring questions.

That actually does answer a lot of my general structure questions, but what I was more referring to was how is it that I arrange the drop itself? Do I continue the sub bass while killing the drums? What drums do I start right after the drop itself to really give it that oomph? How long is the drop typically?

Also, what is the sub bass in terms of sequence? Is it the exact same sequence that I applied to the mid-range bassline that is just downpitched to get that sub action? or is it a complementary sequence?

[alpz]

This image might have give you a little bit on insight into track structure. It's the tune in my signature - the sections are 8 bars each, for reference. Note that the style of dubstep you're looking to do could require a dramatically different structure, so don't take this as a template.

http://i.imgur.com/SVIRL.png

[solidus]

What is the drop structure (how is it arranged)?

Drops usually occur anywhere from 16 to 32 bars into a track...preceeded usually by 4/8bars worth of 'build up' (white noise sweeps/rising tones to build the tension + increased frequency on the drum hits) then kill all the drums and have your Massive midrange noises play.

Did not see this until after my first post...

How do I create the rising tones that are smoothed out? I'm thinking the use of a scale, but what effects would I apply to it to create that smooth transition? Also, how do I increase the frequency of drum hits? Do I change the pattern itself or do I just decrease the "distance" between drum hits (while maintaining the initial ratio)?

Do I keep the drums killed after the drop or do I resume them during whatever midrange stuff I put in?

[wub]

How do I create the rising tones that are smoothed out? I'm thinking the use of a scale, but what effects would I apply to it to create that smooth transition?

Draw a line with a note in a synth. Add a filter to that synth that gradually opens over the course of the 4 bars, and maybe a pitch bend as well so it goes WOOAHHHHHNEEEEEEEEAR!

Also, how do I increase the frequency of drum hits? Do I change the pattern itself or do I just decrease the "distance" between drum hits (while maintaining the initial ratio)?

Decrease the distance between the drum hits.

Do I keep the drums killed after the drop or do I resume them during whatever midrange stuff I put in?

Keep them killed for the first bit of the mid range noises from Massive, then maybe add the risers back end and have the drums gradually return for 4 bars before having the whole tune play out.

[solidus]

This image might have give you a little bit on insight into track structure. It's the tune in my signature - the sections are 8 bars each, for reference. Note that the style of dubstep you're looking to do could require a dramatically different structure, so don't take this as a template.

http://i.imgur.com/SVIRL.png

That actually helps quite a bit. Do you have anything mastered that I can side-by-side to that image to associate different things with?

Keep them killed for the first bit of the mid range noises from Massive, then maybe add the risers back end and have the drums gradually return for 4 bars before having the whole tune play out.

So gradually fade the drums back in?

Also, what is the general production structure of the early dubstep? I'm wanting to produce that style as I enjoy the sound more. Examples being stuff along the likes of Skream's Bahl Fwd and Benga's Middle Man.

[OfficialDAPT]

Do I keep the drums killed after the drop or do I resume them during whatever midrange stuff I put in?

Dude, when I first started off I hated hearing this but you seriously just have to drag songs intro your DAW and copy the arrangment/structure and over time after copying different songs you will learn what sounds good. If your looking how to get punchy drums, there are plenty of kick layering tutorials on youtube. YOUTUBE, YOUTUBE, YOUTUBE! IT IS YOUR FRIEND!