taming unwanted frequencies

[neonmansion]

I was listening to some of my old beats and noticed that if I cranked them loud many of the elements hurt my ears. My newer stuff is much better but not perfect. I noticed that when I A/B my stuff with some of my favorite artists I can turn their music of way louder and not have it sound unpleasant. So I've been working on EQing out annoying frequencies much more.

My question is that other than sweeping a band of freq. to find a harsh freq and notch it out.. are there any other methods anyone knows about to make the mix more smooth and pleasant when it comes to harsh sounding frequencies?

e.g. any specific offending frequencies?? (i.e. 250hz on a kick drum, etc..)

[thrillion]

I think the sweeping technique is your best shot Neonmansion. Would assume there is different bad frequencies for each different sample you use.

[neonmansion]

there has to be some info on frequencies that kill you're ears.. because it can't be the timbre of the instrument. I mean a really shrill piano sound and a really shrill guitar sound would both hurt your ears. I'm thinking there are some freq bands that are displeasing.

[Triphosphate]

There aren't any bad frequencies, just certain frequencies that we hear better than others, and thus can be much quieter in a mix. Or alternatively, frequencies that we hear so well that they will sound 'shrill' or 'too loud' at certain volumes.

You're gonna want to refer to fletcher-Munson curves:
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fletcher–Munson_curves <-WTF hyperlink?

And here's an article I found on using eq with human percieved loudness in mind:
http://www.anstendig.org/EQ.html

I found this to be especially helpful:

When we further reduced the high frequencies in our hearing's most sensitive range between 2000 and 5000 Hz, we were able to raise the volume substantially without anyone noticing. Our conclusions are

1) that our ability to perceive changes in volume is most sensitive in the frequency ranges that we hear loudest;

2) that most of the our much-touted sensitivity to even very small volume changes is not a recognition of degrees of loudness, but rather a recognition of changes in the quality of the sound and an awareness of degrees of irritation, i.e., whether the sound becomes more or less irritating; and

3) that the known fact that our hearing is more forgiving of distortions in equalization at low volume levels than at high volume levels is due to the absence of those high frequencies that are below our threshold of hearing.

Tldr; if you turn down frequencies between 2k and 5khz you can make everything else louder without it sounding irritating.

[Shock Rx]

Ha! Neonmansion, I have this same struggle. A lot of this is due to shit monitors for me. What playback set up do you have? I find when I run into this problem the best soloution next to finding a replacement sample/patch is to bring in the original and layer it with the processed ones. Sidechain and eq a bit, and the result should be better. Also it is good practice to check for harsh freqs periodically as you add processing and fx. I'm still battling this issue, so my tips may be shit. I look forward to what the pros on this board have to say.

[koncide]

I was listening to some of my old beats and noticed that if I cranked them loud many of the elements hurt my ears. My newer stuff is much better but not perfect. I noticed that when I A/B my stuff with some of my favorite artists I can turn their music of way louder and not have it sound unpleasant. So I've been working on EQing out annoying frequencies much more.

My question is that other than sweeping a band of freq. to find a harsh freq and notch it out.. are there any other methods anyone knows about to make the mix more smooth and pleasant when it comes to harsh sounding frequencies?

e.g. any specific offending frequencies?? (i.e. 250hz on a kick drum, etc..)

Trust your ears. The sweeping band technique is your best friend. General rules are very difficult to define when it comes to this sort of thing, as different degrees and types of processing produce different levels.

Once you find a band range that you think is too loud, you can either notch it (simplest) or use multiband compression to reduce it that way. Multiband compression will produce different results to a notch, whichever you think serves you better.

[mthrfnk]

De-essing doesn't have to be confined to just vocals, try it on your high pitched elements you think may be causing you problems... should tame the nasty frequencies down.

[Sharmaji]

depends on context but 400hz-1.2khz can be muddy-to-nasal if there's too much there; 1.8-4k or so can be edgy and shrill.

aside from high and lowpassing things, tight cuts in the offending areas tend to help alot, especially as layers build up.

i definitely multiband or de-ess vox at around 2k quite often, as all the layers come into focus; there can be a huge buildup in that area that makes vocal stacks sound really shrill and awful.

[Artie_Fufkin]

[bkwsk]

5 Minutes to a better mix is a really nice series, even if it's not focused on electronic music.

[smile]

Could be unwanted dissonances? Even "subtle" stuff like using punchy drums that are off-key and interferes with lows/mids can cause some problems.

[VirtualMark]

Adding distortion can often cause nasty resonances. Like mthrfnk said, a de-esser can work wonders. Fabfilter's one is great, very easy to use.

Also dynamic eq's are great - more accurate than a multiband compressor, you can dial in a narrow q and just compress the offending frequencies. This is sometimes more desirable than using a standard eq, as it only attenuates the frequencies when they get too loud.

[bkwsk]

Could be unwanted dissonances? Even "subtle" stuff like using punchy drums that are off-key and interferes with lows/mids can cause some problems.

Off-key kickdrums aren't usually an issue if they're fairly short and not 808-based. Bongos, toms et al. are a completely different thing.

[Augment]

I've heard that Noisia bitchruses/distorts some of the higher frequencies so they don't hurt your ear when you turn the volume up, not sure how this works

[Genevieve]

I just removed some 2k on a kick where I heavily boosted it (-core/gabber kick) and it sounds a lot more focused now :0 way better. Thanks 4 dis /subscribes

[mthrfnk]

I've heard that Noisia bitchruses/distorts some of the higher frequencies so they don't hurt your ear when you turn the volume up, not sure how this works

I remember someone posting this a while back, again still not sure what the actual theory/truth behind this is.

[Triphosphate]

I've heard that Noisia bitchruses/distorts some of the higher frequencies so they don't hurt your ear when you turn the volume up, not sure how this works

I remember someone posting this a while back, again still not sure what the actual theory/truth behind this is.

Maybe distressing? (LPF followed by bitcrushing) Otherwise I can only imagine this builds up more high frequencies?

[Augment]

8:50
Coming from Camo & Krooked, I think I'll experiment a bit with this later

[Artie_Fufkin]

I just removed some 2k on a kick where I heavily boosted it (-core/gabber kick) and it sounds a lot more focused now :0 way better. Thanks 4 dis /subscribes

No, you put that back right now! Gabber kicks are supposed to be fatiguing!

[twilitez]

8:50
Coming from Camo & Krooked, I think I'll experiment a bit with this later

Dont like reading subtitles but it is definitely worth it, these guys know what theyre doing.