Sub Bass Techniques

[neonmansion]

No I'm not talking about how to make one. I think they are pretty straightforward to make actually. But how do you goes implement them?

I.E. do you have a subbass track for every bass sound you use?? Or do you just have one sub bass track and write in separate midi for it to go with other sounds? I was thinking about having a sub bass sound layered with each of my sounds except that I don't want an extra ten instances of massive or whatever when I could just have one,


Anyone have some light to shed?

[wub]

I've always considered using Massive for a sub line a little bit of overkill. I just use 3xOsc with a single sine generator mimicking the movement of my bassline with a few minor alterations to the flow if required.

[neonmansion]

hmm.. i mean i just have massive set to a sine wave.. maybe some tube satch and enveloping to give it some dynamics or punch.. I suppose you could do that with operator or whatever..

Could you explain mimicking? Do you go in a write in automation to compliment the midrange sound?

There are some techniques such as side chained gating that will do that for you. OR using corpus as a resonator to add sub bass.

But the real part of my question was do you do this for every track?? OR do you just use one subbass track to play it all?

[bassinine]

plain sine. 3-5 db saturation, high-pass to taste.

if you want to change it up add some pitch bends/glides/env's.

pretty much all there is to it. mimicking refers to having your sub bass play the same melody as your mids.

and you can gate it if you want, but volume automations/envelopes always sound better. can side chain if ya want, i usually do a little bit if it's long notes mimicking midrange. but if your sub is following your kick, like an 808, then you won't want to side-chain.

[wub]

Using Massive for just a sine generator seems a bit wanton. I generally don't apply any effects to my sub, so no automation. Mimicking I mean it plays the same pattern just down an octave or two.

Not sure what you mean re every track...I'll only ever have one sub line.

[QuiZNo]

I've been experimenting with this more recently. I make my main bass patch and if I think the sub-bass doesn't come out enough especially if it is some kind of heavy midrangy patch then I make another operator patch of just a sine wave. I literally copy and paste the midi clips from the other patch and if I need to I might change it up a bit. I don't do this for every song. For me it really matters on my specific bass patch. If it has enough sub-bass already then I leave it alone.

[bassinine]

Using Massive for just a sine generator seems a bit wanton. I generally don't apply any effects to my sub, so no automation. Mimicking I mean it plays the same pattern just down an octave or two.

Not sure what you mean re every track...I'll only ever have one sub line.

you don't automate the volume and pitch, wub?

[neonmansion]

I meant that for each separate instrument I will group it with a sub-bass. That way when I play that instrument a sub line 2 octaves below plays automatically. But lately I'm finding that is a waste of cpu..

However there would be a way to achieve the same result using midi routing.. i.e. routing each midrange track with a midi router all to a sub bass track send to monitor.. would save a lot of time in the long run

[fragments]

I meant that for each separate instrument I will group it with a sub-bass. That way when I play that instrument a sub line 2 octaves below plays automatically. But lately I'm finding that is a waste of cpu..

However there would be a way to achieve the same result using midi routing.. i.e. routing each I ith a midi router all to a sub bass track send to monitor.. would save a lot of time in the long run

That sounds like a cluster fuck with no purpose to be honest. I basically do what wub does...almost exactly. If my sub follows the midrange I just copy and paste the midi from the midrange into a 3xOSC track. Then tweak whatever needs tweaked. But honestly, I rarely have the sub follow the midrange. I use the sub as an additional groove element that calls and responds with the kick.

[wub]

Using Massive for just a sine generator seems a bit wanton. I generally don't apply any effects to my sub, so no automation. Mimicking I mean it plays the same pattern just down an octave or two.

Not sure what you mean re every track...I'll only ever have one sub line.

you don't automate the volume and pitch, wub?

Sometimes, but not often. Depends on the tune.

[bRRRz]

for everything "normal" (wobbles/straight notes) i have one pure sine sub on which i automate the filter amp for the whole track (in order to make it fit to lfo speeds and envelopes) and for certain synths in which i use vibrato or frequency shifter and stuff like this i just clone that instrument and turn off all effects like distortion, delay, etc. and change it to one osc and sine.

[fv2k]

Just one sub track with a sinewave audio file in Sampler

[lloydy]

I started using 808's because i like that boomy kind of bottom end you get.Also i can't stress enough get psp vintage warmer and tape saturate your sub,instant goodness.
Logic has the test oscillator which is also pretty handy but i will be honest i have used massive for subs.Normally my sub line will be on one track but it depends if i'm using different variations of subs in my tracks.Like with the 808's i might use one stabby note and the other will have a longer release.I will set something like this up on two tracks through two instances of kontakt then just buss them both to the same send.

[mthrfnk]

Depending on what I'm doing I'll either :
1)Add a simple sine/square/triangle sub waveform in during synthesis to suit. I only do this if intend on resampling/granulizing/resynthesising a sound such as a reese or growl with Harmor or FL Granulizer, this is because generally when I do this I end up messing with pitch, playback speed and modulations so adding a seperate sub afterwards never sounds right because it's nearly god damn impossible to get the sub to follow the same route as the midrange. This is much more apparent when I use the Granulizer, because as you automate settings you completely mangle the sound making it impossible to add in a complimentary sub line.

2)I'll add a sub line from a either a pack of analogue sub samples or another pack of pure sine samples in under the sound. I do this with most other things such as chords, melodies, guitars and pads etc. If the sound needs beefing, I'll just layer the subline and most often just mimick the notes but a few octaves lower. I don't often do much to this, because the samples already sound nice - in most cases the analogue samples are more than a simple sine so sometimes I end up EQ'ing out the mid-high end just to get the low end. Otherwise not much else.

[neonmansion]

yeah.. i've been trying some experimental sub bass techniques such as using corpus

did you know you can create a low sub freq with corpus and then control the pitch with the midi of your sound?

[bkwsk]

yeah.. i've been trying some experimental sub bass techniques such as using corpus

did you know you can create a low sub freq with corpus and then control the pitch with the midi of your sound?

Yup, Corpus has got a ton of different uses, greatly underrated by some people imo.

Here's a "killer" -but subtle- sub patch in Abe. Essentially just a sine wave as everyone already stated, but with some added harmonics to give it some grit and allow it to cut through the mix better.

Here it is playing E0: http://i50.tinypic.com/jkdk69.jpg

(Base Freq on the Saturator is tuned manually depending on what key I plan on composing the tune as it generates moar harmonics).

[arktrix45hz]

plain sine. 3-5 db saturation, high-pass to taste.

if you want to change it up add some pitch bends/glides/env's.

pretty much all there is to it. mimicking refers to having your sub bass play the same melody as your mids.

and you can gate it if you want, but volume automations/envelopes always sound better. can side chain if ya want, i usually do a little bit if it's long notes mimicking midrange. but if your sub is following your kick, like an 808, then you won't want to side-chain.

High cut you mean surely? If you high pass, you're removing all low end?

[bkwsk]

Guess he could also be referring to high-passing your sub at like 25-35 Hz, somewhere in that range, to let more energy/headroom into the mix, using a steep high pass curve (48dB per octave like in Fab's Pro-Q, for example). But I wouldn't know obv.

[neonmansion]

yeah.. i've been trying some experimental sub bass techniques such as using corpus

did you know you can create a low sub freq with corpus and then control the pitch with the midi of your sound?

Yup, Corpus has got a ton of different uses, greatly underrated by some people imo.

Here's a "killer" -but subtle- sub patch in Abe. Essentially just a sine wave as everyone already stated, but with some added harmonics to give it some grit and allow it to cut through the mix better.

Here it is playing E0: http://i50.tinypic.com/jkdk69.jpg

(Base Freq on the Saturator is tuned manually depending on what key I plan on composing the tune as it generates moar harmonics).

HAH i appreciate the attention to detail you use

but why do you have an amp set completely to wet? does that not add all shorts of upper harmonics?

and where did you find out about the "base" frequency? it doesn't seem to have note values so how do you know

[bkwsk]

1. I posted the values so you could try it out yourself. Play a low note (between D0-C1 if your monitors/headphones allow you to) with the D/W to 100% and then lower it down. Total mess. While at 100% most of the odd harmonics and whatnot are being kept down by the -2.30 Bass on the Amp and the -4.x Presence. But again, try it out yourself, see what sounds good for you.

2. I use Ableton's Spectrum for this a lot. Get it nice and big, play a C2 -for example- using a simple sine wave patch and move your cursor to where the fundamental is peaking. Abe's Spectrum will tell you the note/frequency your cursor is at.

Edit: btw, lol @ the watermarks at the end of the tune in your sig.