Best sidechaining method

[Bass_Jacka]

Someone elses thread about compressors spured me on to ask this;

What would you guys say is the best method for sidechaining? Leads, sub, vocals etc. for example.

I've always just used the stadard compressor that comes with Cubase, but in all honesty I'm not entirely happy with the effect it gives when sidechaining. What would the best compressor for sidechaining be, in your opinions?

Also, are there other ways of sidechaining other than using a compressor? Is it possible to sidechain using an EQ; i.e. having a sound duck to a certain frequency when 'triggered'?

Cheers

[wub]

Is it possible to sidechain using an EQ; i.e. having a sound duck to a certain frequency when 'triggered'?

Cheers

Yes, I do this instead of using a compressor. Have the Fruity Peak Controller as the trigger, sidechained to Parametric EQ2. I usually set it so that the element that is triggering the sidechain causes the EQ to 'duck' a specific frequency range depending on what the elements are.

For example, say you've got a snare hitting at 200hz as the trigger, and the EQ on some pads. I'd have it setup so that everytime the snare hits, the pad EQ drops out at 200hz to give it space to come through in the mix.

There are a number of threads on this discussion already, have a search through and it might through up some reading material, for example;

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http://www.dubstepforum.com/search.php?keywords=sidechaining&terms=all&author=&fid[]=8&sc=1&sf=titleonly&sr=topics&sk=t&sd=d&st=0&ch=300&t=0&submit=Search

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http://www.dubstepforum.com/search.php?keywords=sidechain&terms=all&author=&fid[]=8&sc=1&sf=titleonly&sr=topics&sk=t&sd=d&st=0&ch=300&t=0&submit=Search

Copy & paste those into your URL bar...they'll give you a list of threads with the word 'Sidechaining' or 'Sidechain' in the title

[swerver]

You'd probably be better using a multi-band compressor than an EQ and just duck a particular frequency range. Can't really recommend one tho, don't use em much myself.

[Bass_Jacka]

Is it possible to sidechain using an EQ; i.e. having a sound duck to a certain frequency when 'triggered'?

Cheers

For example, say you've got a snare hitting at 200hz as the trigger, and the EQ on some pads. I'd have it setup so that everytime the snare hits, the pad EQ drops out at 200hz to give it space to come through in the mix.

As dumb as it may sound, I've never thought of going about it that way. I've always just eq'd the pads so that they don't interfer with the snare hitting at say 200hz, and then just applied the standard compressor sidechaining to the pad to make it duck completely. Will definitely have to give this a go.

How would I duck a specific frequency of a sound? The stanard EQ on cubase doesn't have a sidechain option, does it?

Cheers Wub!

[wub]

How would I duck a specific frequency of a sound? The stanard EQ on cubase doesn't have a sidechain option, does it?

Not familiar with how to do it in Cubase, but a quick Google I found this;

http://www.psynews.org/forums/index.php ... -chain-eq/

just want to know if you can side-chain EQ in cubase 5 like you can side-chain compress. i want to be able to cut all frequencies' below say 100 / 120 Hz on the off beat when the bass is playing. just wondering if you can get a midi track to trigger an EQ to do this. i know how to side-chain compress but that is easy thanks to the handy little button they placed in the compressor plug-in.

• creat a stereo group and invert the phase.
• put a sidechain-gate in the group and put the bass in the sidechain of the gate, so the gate opens when the bass is playing.
• now put an e.q. in the group with a lowpass around 100hz (put the e.q. after the gate, and experiment with the cutoff of the lowpass and also the slope).
• now send everything (sending, not routing!!) to the group where you wanna kill the lows when the bass is playing @ 0db (when you don't want to kill the lows
• completely, try to send it with lower levels like -3db to -6db etc.).

If that helps.

[fragments]

You'd probably be better using a multi-band compressor than an EQ and just duck a particular frequency range. Can't really recommend one tho, don't use em much myself.

Why? Care to explain. Curious why you'd recommend a tool/method you don't actually employ yourself.

[swerver]

You'd probably be better using a multi-band compressor than an EQ and just duck a particular frequency range. Can't really recommend one tho, don't use em much myself.

Why? Care to explain. Curious why you'd use a tool/method you don't actually employ yourself.

The guy asked about ducking certain frequencies, I'm aware of multiband compressors which would probably do what he wants, although I haven't used them too much myself so didn't want to recommend one. Simple really.

[Trichome]

Automation > Sidechaining

Gives you so much more control, sounds much cleaner, and uses less CPU

IMO of course, Sidechaining has some advantages too

[Bass_Jacka]

Thanks for the input people; much appreciated and helpful!

Automation > Sidechaining

Gives you so much more control, sounds much cleaner, and uses less CPU

IMO of course, Sidechaining has some advantages too

Do you mean manually automate/draw in automation so that a specific frequency ducks at the same time as a snare/kick or other trigger hitting?

Wouldn't this be far more time consuming; drawing automation for every 'duck'. I mean for house it would probably be easy as the kick/snare are pretty straight so you could simply copy and paste the automation over. Surely for dubstep/drum and bass where kicks/snares may be a bit more sporadic it's a bit of agro writting in automation?

[Trichome]

It is time consuming, but it has the massive advantage of being able to adjust the curve for each "duck" separately, and IMO it's only long for the first pattern as you can just copy and paste the rest and make a small change for each drum pattern, or w/e

For me it's more annoying having loads of compressors and peak controllers on each track, it all depends on your workflow though i guess

[Add9]

I tried drawing the automation in for a while, it ended up being really time consuming though. Now I just use white noise in Massive as the sidechain trigger, then automate the sustain and the morph amount in the amp envelope to change the sidechain length and curve if I have to.

[EARTH_MOVER]

Why not use a gate?

I'm not sure about how to go about it in your daw, but in ableton I just set the gate to let's say the snare, adjust accordingly and flip the gate, so the bass or lead or whatever it is ducks down when it hits.

[mthrfnk]

I manually automate mixer channel volumes (e.g. slowly duck synths when I have vocals come in) and I sometimes manually sidechain, other times I use triggers for volume sidechaining - depends what sounds best.

I also use EQ ducks sidechained to my kicks and snares/claps.

I never use a compressor to sidechain, it sounds so much cleaner (imo) to do the the combo of EQ/volume ducking.

To people who say doing stuff manually is "too time consuming" - I prefer to have that level of control over a mix and I find that it really does pay off for the sort of music I try to make. It doesn't really take that long in FL once you know what you're doing.

[Add9]

If only automation in Logic were like it is in Reason then I would do everything manually... but working with automation in Logic as we all know is one of the most tedious things you can possibly do. It just destroys my workflow, and workflow is such a huge part of making a successful track.

[Hollotronic]

First post on here finally!

OP. I got the Cubase compressor to react better for me for sidechaining by setting the analysis knob to Peak. It defaults toward RMS when you first open it.

[Huts]

Recently started moving further away from compressors and using Cableguys VolumeShaper. I kept getting clicks and what not on certain sounds I sidechained and it was driving me crazy, plus it allows for a lot more control and I can visually see what's happening. LFO tool, volumeshaper, gross beat, they're all basically types of volume automation without having to draw in ever duck. Not sure if you can link them to EQ's and what not, but I've never really tried

[Icetickle]

Abletons autofilter has a sidechain option. But I cut a lot of my sounds around 300Hz.. so yeah

[Trichome]

Recently started moving further away from compressors and using Cableguys VolumeShaper. I kept getting clicks and what not on certain sounds I sidechained and it was driving me crazy, plus it allows for a lot more control and I can visually see what's happening. LFO tool, volumeshaper, gross beat, they're all basically types of volume automation without having to draw in ever duck. Not sure if you can link them to EQ's and what not, but I've never really tried

I use gross beat sometimes, I just wish you could make the patterns longer