Arrangement ?

sinewave · Post by **sinewave** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 10:00 am

I've recently started creating some Dubstep orientated loops and sequences, but I'm finding it difficult to arrange them in such a way that warrents it to be worthy of a song.

Does anyone else have this problem ? I just start off with a few loops get about a minute into a track then I'm completely lost as to which direction to take my track next. I never used to have this problem before!

2000f · Post by **2000f** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 10:03 am

You might want to try analyze a "typical" Dubstep tune and for a start copy that arrangement. Then you´ll be able to get a feel of how to arrange your own tunes.

sinewave · Post by **sinewave** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 10:07 am

2000F wrote:You might want to try analyze a "typical" Dubstep tune and for a start copy that arrangement. Then you´ll be able to get a feel of how to arrange your own tunes.

I tried that with a track yesterday, but then it went a bit pear-shaped. Maybe I was analysing the track too hard without focusing on mine. I'll give it a go again this week, with another tune maybe.

j_j · Post by **j_j** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 11:02 am

2000F wrote:You might want to try analyze a "typical" Dubstep tune and for a start copy that arrangement. Then you´ll be able to get a feel of how to arrange your own tunes.

nah u dont wanna do that...u wanna follow the momentuem of ur instruments and write around that.dnt worry if its 2 mins or 5 mins ..dnt matter ..the tune is just the tune.

2000f · Post by **2000f** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 11:06 am

Well, if he hasn´t got a clue what to do I actually reckon my suggestion might be of his interest. A tune is a tune, of course. But it seems to me that he isn´t satisfied with his result and need inspiration. And in this case listening and analyzing other Dubstep tunes might be an option.

sinewave · Post by **sinewave** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 11:12 am

2000F wrote:Well, if he hasn´t got a clue what to do I actually reckon my suggestion might be of his interest. A tune is a tune, of course. But it seems to me that he isn´t satisfied with his result and need inspiration. And in this case listening and analyzing other Dubstep tunes might be an option.

i'm a "she"

j_j · Post by **j_j** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 11:18 am

nah nah nah..make ur own style ..which is a typical dubstep tune then?

the way u use arrangement can be as fundamental to ur productions as the sounds u use..finding ur own route is key to having ur own style..or when ur in a studio collabing with someone do u say .one sec jus gotta rip a arrangement now then well be done lol ..

sinewave · Post by **sinewave** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 11:30 am

i think you're both making valid points here.

but i think a good way is to just look at the general structure of tracks, not bar by bar, but just as a rough guide as to where or when to introduce a hat section or whatever.

but i understand that you've got to make your sounds creatively as you do with arrangement, which i dont have a problem with at the moment (the sound creation that is)..

deepsix · Post by **deepsix** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 11:34 am

I figure that they're both right - you can definitely learn from the "masters" - the "gold standards" if you will. And then branch out from there creatively.

You, in essence, want to create something that will fit in the dubstep mentality / vibe / mix, but something that's your own; not a DMZ clone (though that might not be a bad thing

)

I say analyze for the raw elements of style / building blocks of arrangement. But then change what you don't feel fits you / the tune you're working on.

While all cookies aren't made with a cutter, they're all made from dough.

Best of luck!

2000f · Post by **2000f** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 11:51 am

J_J wrote:nah nah nah..make ur own style ..which is a typical dubstep tune then?

the way u use arrangement can be as fundamental to ur productions as the sounds u use..finding ur own route is key to having ur own style..or when ur in a studio collabing with someone do u say .one sec jus gotta rip a arrangement now then well be done lol ..

You really want to misunderstand me, mate?

Well, the majority of all released tunes follow som very basic arrangement rules with regards to lenght of intro, breakdown etc. No track is the same, and this is not the point. But if inspiration is needed, analyzing might (please read, "might") be an option. Not saying that you ought to clone the track, but rather get the overall feel of the arrangement. I have never written that cloning tracks is what you ought to do, mate. We are talking about inspiration, and I´ll bet that you (in one way or th other) have been inspired (directly or indirectly) by other Dubstep productions. And eventhough I generaly agree to a point that no rules is the key, there is some basic elements with regards to arrangements that I think Sinewave (sorry, girl

could benefit from getting into. Anyway, I reckon you what I mean, and you should know that I agree 101% with regards to your opinions, but she asked for some arrangemtn inspiration, and telling her to keep arranging as she already does might not be the ticket.

And a "typical" Dubstep tune could be anything from your stuff to DMZ to Kode 9 to El-B to Skream to DQ1 to Distance to Burial to Mark One to Benga to Loefah to Emalkay to KION to JSL to Shonky to Threnody to myself etc. Just as long as it´s an inspiring tune it might help her.

andythetwig · Post by **andythetwig** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 12:19 pm

everybody in every production thread wrote:Do what you feel

one thing that is common to all dj-friendly dubplates, the beat always comes in strong and bare so it's easy to mix, and finishes on a similar tip. I follow a vague skream formula- which is actually very similar to a lot of house tunes. (Actually skream isn't using this formula any more but it helps illustrate a point)

- I have 16 or more bars of beats with a really slow build into a full drum/effect sound- maybe hints of a melody.
- Then a massive breakdown for the mixout, a 4/8 build with no beats and some heavily processed version of the main bassline/melody.
- The a massive boom as the all the parts come back in (this is where people are supposed to skream! and throw their hands in the air)
- The tricky bit I find is the next part- creating a variation of the melody, with bridges inbetween this second part and the first. I think the reason why request line sounded so brillantly complete is because the bridge between the melody in the two keys was perfect (and very musical)- it never sounds repetitive.
- Then later on you can have an even bigger breakdown than the first, and really go to town on your vocal samples. Vex'd are the dogs nad's at breakdowns.
- in the final section, let the melody drop back to hints, and the beats take over again.

But there are actually very few dubstep tunes that follow this housey formula, most of the ones I have heard are very much on the back foot, with parts drifting in and out almost randomly. So don't get too obsessed with the whole 4/8/16/32 bar pattern things- incidental parts are the key to making a unique sound.

disclaimer- I have never studied music, so I may have the names for all of the above completely wrong!

j_j · Post by **j_j** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 2:24 pm

no..im not telling her anything.its just better to find your own way to get what u want.exacting elements of other peoples arrangements will lead to a stale formulaeic sound.'mistakes' r good..

ramadanman · Post by **ramadanman** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 8:37 pm

seriously do what sounds best

analysing what OTHER people are doing too much leads to a stale production

forensix (mcr) · Post by **forensix (mcr)** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 11:28 pm

ramadanman wrote:seriously do what sounds best

analysing what OTHER people are doing too much leads to a stale production

at the end of the day we all analyse other people without thinking about it there's always a part of us that wants to make something completely different but then you still want dj's to play it out and some of them wont play a tune that's really difficult to mix

just my 2cents

ramadanman · Post by **ramadanman** » Tue Jun 20, 2006 8:23 am

Yeh i agree with this to a certain extent

but then again, take tunes like that new (i think its DMZ) one. it has about a bar of noise and then BANG it drops. its the one with that female vocal over.

sinewave · Post by **sinewave** » Tue Jun 20, 2006 8:29 am

cheers peeps !

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